What was before the big bang?

[GOD]

"I will stop talking, because you deny any common ground. Sweet dreams, max."

 

[restin]

wow, cool, attack the other side until you've won. :roll:

That's why I dislike atheist society - you have lost dreams of Truth. All you can talk of is probability, induction and other shit. You tell others to wake up but I tell you - start dreaming again!

 

[maxfreakout]

wow, cool, attack the other side until you've won. :roll:

The Scientologist's motto - "Don't defend, attack!"

That's why I dislike atheist society - you have lost dreams of Truth. All you can talk of is probability, induction and other shit. You tell others to wake up but I tell you - start dreaming again!

Life is a dream, you can't wake up from it, but you CAN become lucid 8)

 

[Pariah]

Oy Vey!

Block Universe?!

No wonder you're so confused about all of this stuff. Block universe fails to account for so much of reality: direction of time, entropy, past present and future among other things, or in other word: what is it that makes time a true dimension in the sense of the other commonly experienced three? Its a huge leap backwards in understanding, it also can't be tested if I remember correctly. Its only merit as far as I'm concerned is that its a "cool idea" which people like to believe in, because it makes them feel secure.

Einstein's philosophical assumption of locality has already been thrown out of the window for the most part; hence new quantum technologies such as quantum cryptology among other things using quantum entanglement.

Using waking life as an example is unhelpful too - the philosophical talk one of the characters gives (the one on determinism) rejects probabilistic theory purely on "not *wanting* to be a series of random events" - it is an arbitrary preference to see reality that way, its not using evidence.

 

[Crimzen]

wow, cool, attack the other side until you've won. :roll:

That's why I dislike atheist society - you have lost dreams of Truth. All you can talk of is probability, induction and other shit. You tell others to wake up but I tell you - start dreaming again!

atheist society?
i didnt think there was such a thing

dreams of truth? i prefer real truth that i can see wide awake with my eyes open
rather than a dreamed up image of truth which involves unnecessary unrealistic spirits and deities

 

[restin]

atheist society?
i didnt think there was such a thing

Wake up then :wink:

dreams of truth? i prefer real truth that i can see wide awake with my eyes open
rather than a dreamed up image of truth which involves unnecessary unrealistic spirits and deities

you didn't get it.

Pariah, Pariah *sigh*

 

[Crimzen]

wake up to an atheist society?
really? because last time i checked most of the population of the world was religious

 

[restin]

no,no. I am talking about here, us, the western society. First we had the Gods in hour hearts, then in our houses, then in the temples and then we lost them entirely. God is dead. "Religious"....we have lost religion when we built the first church. I don't know if I ever saw a really religious person.

 

[GOD]

Crap . How many actualy worship ? How many follow their religeons ? How many of those are realy religeous and how many are pseudo religeous hypocrits ?

Most of the people on this planet are godless , greedy , egocentric bigots and hypocrits .

 

[Crimzen]

ok be that as it may

how many are atheist?

 

[restin]

do you want numbers? :lol:

I can't say, it depends on how you define atheism. Compare Camus with Dawkins. Camus was an atheist in a way of life, in a philosophy - he meant it and understood. He was free. Dawkins is just an asshole that enjoys smashing things he does not understand. A really disgusting person, from what I heard and read of him. He is no atheist, he is nihilist in a nasty way.

What do you understand with atheism?

 

[Crimzen]

at one point i knew the numbers and it wasnt much, less than 5%
what do i understand with it? about it?
atheism by definition is a lack of belief in a god or supreme power
but there are a few different definitions
it can mean a lack of belief in god OR a belief that there is no god

its just semantics really

anyone who claims they are religious usually believes in a god whether or not they worship or pray or go to church doesnt matter its the belief that counts

im of the belief that there is no god or deity anywhere, be it in another dimension or on top of the clouds or whatever

the beauty of atheism is that its a LACK of belief rather than a real 'group'
is there a name for people who dont believe in gnomes? or unicorns? or teapots that orbit the earth?

 

[GOD]

"is there a name for people who dont believe in gnomes? or unicorns? or teapots that orbit the earth?"

Yes , normal .

Your arguing against your own definition of "god" . Isnt it time we stoped talking about personal definitions of words and started trying to understand ?

 

[Crimzen]

no i didnt once argue the definition of god
i argued what atheist meant
it doesnt mean anything, once we start naming people for what they DONT believe in then we're fucked

 

[maxfreakout]

Block universe fails to account for so much of reality: direction of time,entropy, past present and future among other things,

that ^ is just 3 different ways of saying "the direction of time"

the direction of time is purely an illusory subjective experience, it has no basis in the ultimate reality of the block-universe. And there are no 'other things' that the block universe model fails to account for, it is an entirely comprehensive model of reality, and it eliminates sequential causality

or in other word: what is it that makes time a true dimension in the sense of the other commonly experienced three?

time is a spatial dimension just like the other 3 dimensions are

Its only merit as far as I'm concerned is that its a "cool idea" which people like to believe in, because it makes them feel secure.

How does it make people feel secure?

The merit of the block universe model is that it provides a coherent model of reality - which fits in with the revelations of the psychedelic experience

Using waking life as an example is unhelpful too

I didnt use waking life as an example of anything, so this ^ comment is not relevant to anything i have said

 

[restin]

at one point i knew the numbers and it wasnt much, less than 5%
what do i understand with it? about it?
atheism by definition is a lack of belief in a god or supreme power
but there are a few different definitions
it can mean a lack of belief in god OR a belief that there is no god

First of all, these numbers are inaccurate, as I am officially Christian but would not call myself that way. That's the first difference.

There are people that are generally against Religions, that call themselves atheists because this is "in", people who simply don't understand anything really. Atheists are not people who believe in science or evolution, that's not the point. Neither of these people is atheist.

Atheism is not a lack of belief. Atheism is a philosophy that indeed is huge and not simple to understand. Read

A lot of people say "there is no God" without understanding what God is. They are just to stupid or lazy to understand it.

Read some Sartre or Camus.

 

[maxfreakout]

Dawkins is just an asshole that enjoys smashing things he does not understand. A really disgusting person, from what I heard and read of him. He is no atheist, he is nihilist in a nasty way.

Dawkin's book 'the God delusion' didnt provide a single philosophical argument for atheism, the whole book boils down to ONE incredibly simpleminded and invalid argument, basically "religious people sometimes do bad things, therefore God doesnt exist"

Dawkins confuses 'religion' with 'religious people' imo (or rather - 'people who call themselves religious people')

 

[Crimzen]

no restin i think you will find that atheism is a lack of belief rather than a philosophy although there are many philosophies involving atheism

not believing in god has never been "in" its foolish to say so as it often brings ostracism with it
its not 'cool' to not believe in god its simply what you see from your perspective

 

[Forkbender]

Dawkin's book 'the God delusion' didnt provide a single philosophical argument for atheism, the whole book boils down to ONE incredibly simpleminded and invalid argument, basically "religious people sometimes do bad things, therefore God doesnt exist"

At least we can agree on that.

 

[restin]

no restin i think you will find that atheism is a lack of belief rather than a philosophy although there are many philosophies involving atheism

Then atheism = nihilism?

not believing in god has never been "in" its foolish to say so as it often brings ostracism with it
its not 'cool' to not believe in god its simply what you see from your perspective

This may be the difference of the places we live in...A lot of people I know call themselves atheists because it is en vogue. Any other europeans experiencing this?