MAOIs FACTS

[maxfreakout]

I think you get the experts wrong, terrence mckenna says in some taped interviews (probably you can fin it on youtube) about the great combination of reu and mushrooms,

He most certainly did get the experts wrong, even the experts he quotes are not saying what he claims they are saying

Mckenna even advised people NOT to do this particular combo because it is so strong, which is highly unusual advice from him!

 

[Brewmaster]

They should come and arrest you for being such a liar

 

[maxfreakout]

i sincerely hope he returns to this thread he started at some point, it's been whizzing round in my head ever since i first saw it, God is effectively saying that the most profound psychedelic experience i've ever had didnt really happen :x

 

[Soulcatcher]

and who is god to judge about that

god is a state of mind.

 

[gammagoblin]

maybe the MAOi doesn't potentiates the psilocybin in the mushroom,
but I have read somewhere on the internet (sorry can't find the page atm) that mushrooms also can contain small amounts of DMT or other DMT-related chemicals, as a result of non-finished synthesis to psilocybin or something like that.
But if this is the case, the MAOi enables these substances to work orally and then it would potentiate the mushrooms.

 

[silv]

Like homeopathy , wich although i know its been proven over and over again to be 100% psychological works sometimes for me . Are you saying that the experts i named above are , "categorically" , wrong ? Are not experts ? Are you saying that you are not being subjective ? Please read the thread again and be objective , as far as that is possible in our subjective existence .

LOVE GOD

That or the (i don't know if it is or isn't) apparent bs they talk about homeopathy with the water taking on the effects of the highly dilluted stuff is some as of yet unexplained phenomena in physics. To illustrate I'll quote the professor of my best friend who's studying physics: "5 years ago we knew 20% of what the universe is made of, now we know 5% of what the universe is made of. Have fun studying physics".
Also fuck the experts, homeopathic stuff works. I don't quite remember (my mother does) but when I was 9 or 10 I kind of accidentally had a full pot of the homeopathic painkillers (baf i think they're called) and well they sure did their work, knocked me straight out.
I guess my point is that scientific research is quite often not done properly as opposed to what you would think. Having 4 siblings and a sister in law studying in university (and myself too) has taught me the most that scientists although good researchers really do make mistakes/draw wrong conclusions/do fundametally wrong experiments.
And that I love you
And Jahvisions, a likeminded spirit

 

[maxfreakout]

But a more important point, i think, is that the sources that GOD provided in the first post DO NOT say that MAOIs dont potentiate psilocybin, despite GOD's claims to the contrary, therefoire there is no reason whatsoever to suggest that they don't

 

[skoeip]

last night I read a bit out of treu halucinations of terrence mckenna, he actualy wrote in his book that they smoked in the middle of a mushroom trip a bit of Banisteriopsis caapi and they caled it vegtable television. so by this book it looks to me he says that the smoking of a maoi does interact with the mushrooms.

 

[skoeip]

last night I read a bit out of treu halucinations of terrence mckenna, he actualy wrote in his book that they smoked in the middle of a mushroom trip a bit of Banisteriopsis caapi and they caled it vegtable television. so by this book it looks to me he says that the smoking of a maoi does interact with the mushrooms.

 

[maxfreakout]

MAOIs do potentiate mushrooms, unless GOD can provide any evidence to the contrary, which he certainly hasn't so far........

 

[tryptonaut]

I have tried 5g rue and 6g dried cubensis once and I can say I never in my life experienced such a fucking deep and dark trip before. I have done dozens and dozens of shroom trips and I know they can come out really different from time to time, but this was extreme. I have done shroom trips with 8 and 9 grams before that were also pretty hard, but not like this one.

You might still call it a placebo (I know it wasn't) but there's one thing I know for a fact that was very different from a normal shroom trip: Ten hours after ingestion I was still tripping, eleven hours after ingestion my pupils were still as large as they can get. Also the trip didn't come fast like usually. I felt almost nothing for 2 hours and four hours after ingestion it was still getting stronger. From then on it felt like it was never going to end.
So, even if you think it doesn't do anything to the quality of the trip, it definitely makes the trip longer.

btw. I have once done 5g rue and 9g mimosa hostilis and this came closer to the rue and shrooms trip than anything else.

 

[VerusDeus]

It's not placebo, obviously not. I mean who here on this forum hasn't tripped his balls off on shroomoasca? There is plenty of evidence against it being placebo.

Maybe the trip gets more intense because syrian rue contains Pinoline, which is a precursor to DMT, and just like DMT it is a psychotropic substance found in the human body(and plants etc).

If it's not the pinoline, there are thousands more possible explanations. It's NOT placebo!

 

[GOD]

I dont want to cause trouble , i`m doing my best to be helpfull and friendly , please can you be patient with me and if i make any mistakes or am unintentionaly objectionable please try to help me to get it right without insulting me or baiting me over and over again . I have been told you all have offered me help , said that you want to be friendly here , so do i . Can you please show me that friendlyness and help from now on ? I will do my best to do that with you to . I have said that i will change my styl , will you please give me the chance to do that and stop the witch hunt ? You know that i get very upset when people take swipes at my personality instead of talking about what i say . What about the people who have offered me help giving me help ? Why doesnt someone say next time that someone has a go at me "Hey , leave him alone , hes on his knees , hes hurting , stop kicking him when he is down , hes told us that he is so upset that he cant eat , sleep or shit and that he is dissabled , maybe thats why he cant understand what we expect from him " ?
Someone said i was wrong when i said that A.Shulgin said that MAOIs dont work with Psilocybin . I was so concerned that i had got it wrong that i read the whole book again and now i`m confused . What does A.Shulgin mean on page 295 of tihkal with what he says on line 15 starting with the word "Recently" down to the end of the paragraph with the word "itself" please ? Then have i missunderstood what he says on page 300 starting on line 8 with the word "whereas" down to the words "in test animals" ? Can anyone help me there please ?
I was under the impression that psychology played a major roll in what people experience when they take things without internationaly scientificly explained effects . I can only think of one way i can get what i mean about the psychological effects / placebo effects of such things over so please be patient with me again . Before T.Mckenna said that there is a world full of maschine elves waiting for us on DMT trips no one ever claimed that before . Now that people have heard about that , they often experience exactly what he said . But people who have never heard what he said never experience it , why is that ? Have i missunderstood ? The other thing that i thought that some kind , friendly person could explain to me is that if someone does the proper preperations before taking Psilocybin = doesnt eat for 4 hours before and then drinks a mushroom tee , with what could the harmala / moai react with in the stomach to potentiate the trip ?

Brewmaster if you have the book tikal you can read what i said the people at the south american churches say , that you told us is not true on page 291 . Please read the second paragraph . Maybe if he hasnt got it someone else could explain the facts there to him . It would also be nice of you if you stoped saying that this is a matter of winning or loosing , that it is a matter of sane or insane .

To the other people who say the experts i quoted didnt say what i say they say , havent you read the begining of this thread where i quote what they say ? I realy dont understand how anyone can deny , after reading the quotes from them above , that they have said what they have said ??? When i show you the quotes from J.Ott wich are the only ones that i havent proved up till now what about admitting it ? What about admitting that you have made a mistake and that they realy did say what i have proven that they have said ? I dont expect anyone to crawl or get on their knees but maybe some one could be brave enough to apologise for it if i prove it ???

I wrote this without reading the thread since a few of you have replied . If you are realy intersted in me answering your questions i would be gratefull if i am allowed to . It will take a little time as i am TOTALY fucked at the moment , i`ve lost 5 kilos in weight this week .

 

[maxfreakout]

GOD maybe you should only post in this particular thread when you arent fucked, this is a sensitive issue you are raising and you are not arguing in a rational way and in my personal opinion you sound like an idiot, no offence meant, but what you seem to be claiming is actually quite annoying

In neither of the 2 places you mention in TIKHAL does it say that MAOIs don't potentiate shrooms, and it DOES NOT say in any of the quotes you gave on the first post in this thread, that MAOIs don't potentiate shrooms

Also, there is a VAST amount of experiential evidence you could easily draw on to establish that MAOIs do in fact potantiate shrooms. have a look at the experience results in erowid, and talk to people here about their experiences with rue and shrooms, i can tell you personally that this combo knoocked my socks off and left me an anxious terrified wreck, which is all the proof i need

And, there is a perfectly reasonable explanation which may explain this phenomenon, MAO in the gut partially breaks down the psilocybin content of any ingested shrooms, so when you take an MAOI in advance of shrooms more psilocybin is allowed to pass unmetabolized to the brain

 

[HeartCore]

I dont want to cause trouble , i`m doing my best to be helpfull and friendly , please can you be patient with me and if i make any mistakes or am unintentionaly objectionable please try to help me to get it right without insulting me or baiting me over and over again . I have been told you all have offered me help , said that you want to be friendly here , so do i . Can you please show me that friendlyness and help from now on ? I will do my best to do that with you to . I have said that i will change my styl , will you please give me the chance to do that and stop the witch hunt ? You know that i get very upset when people take swipes at my personality instead of talking about what i say . What about the people who have offered me help giving me help ? Why doesnt someone say next time that someone has a go at me "Hey , leave him alone , hes on his knees , hes hurting , stop kicking him when he is down , hes told us that he is so upset that he cant eat , sleep or shit and that he is dissabled , maybe thats why he cant understand what we expect from him " ?

The only one that can hurt you, is you. Thats a fact brother I don't object to any style but I tend to skip every other line in extremely long postings I also agree when someone just says:"what you sow is what you get". When I second that, I agree with the concept and it has nothing to do with two weeks of enlightenment (btw ENLIGHTEN me please on that book you mentioned in a post which I can't find now because I have been very busy the past three weeks and must have forgotten).God I did and do love you, for real and I just want to pull you up by you hairs, kiss you on the forehead and tell you to chill the fuck out...You are among friends here, or as Terence once said:'THIS is your affinity group" .

 

[izmar]

With your nick I don't think you need to ingest more en-theo-genics

I have just read the parts you discussed. Especially p. 295 makes clear what Shulgin is trying to say. I think it's a language issue that you misinterpreted what he wrote, although I'm not sure.

From Tihkal p. 295:
"A wide variety of grasses, roots, bark and leaves have been explored. Another alkaloid that needs inhibition of its destruction is 5-MeO-DMT, which is also widely found in many natural sources. It, too, is not normally active orally. Recently, however, there has been a move to explore many other well known drugs as this second component, perhaps illogically in that all these are well established as being orally active."

What I think he's saying is that the MAOIs play a crucial role in oral DMT and 5-MeO-DMT, ayahuasca, anahuasca and pharmahuasca (basically any combination of an MAOI with DMT and in many cases also 5-MeO-DMT). This is because DMT and 5-MeO-DMT would not be active when orally ingested by itself. Nowadays, however, people are also exploring what's going on when they use MAOIs prior to ingesting compounds that are already orally active without an MAOI. So the MAOI is not really used to make a compound psychoactive in non-DMT cases, but rather to modify the already present effects.

The most common reason why MAOIs are used in combination with mushrooms (which is the most common MAOI/psychedelic combination besides DMT) is because they add 1 or 2 hours to the effect. More and more reports are generated that the mix of the MAOI 'buzz' with the psilocybin experience is pleasant, healing or useful.

 

[maxfreakout]

ok here is a piece of evidence from a qualified 'expert' which, unlike anything GOD has posted so far on this thread, is actually relevant to the issue of Syrian Rue and mushrooms in combination:

Mushroom ayahuasca - funky what a little rue can do - by James Kent:

http://www.erowid.org/plants/mushrooms/ ... cle7.shtml

 

[Meduzz]

ok here is a piece of evidence from a qualified 'expert' which, unlike anything GOD has posted so far on this thread, is actually relevant to the issue of Syrian Rue and mushrooms in combination:

Mushroom ayahuasca - funky what a little rue can do - by James Kent:

http://www.erowid.org/plants/mushrooms/ ... cle7.shtml

imho, this is not quite an answer, it's more like some blah blah blah about MAOI and shrooms and then an extraction method for rue.
not a word about the mechanism behind MAOI + Shrooms.

also, it's not because it's on the internet that its 100% true, unless proven by solid scientific facts (which your article does not).

Want to hear my version?

It is true that the nitrogen atom will form hydrogen bondings.
thus imho preventing the psilocybin molecule from being broken down by MAOI, because the N atom and its surrounding atoms give DMT and psilocybin/psilocin the characteristics of a mono-amine, which is broken down by MONO-AMINE oxidase (MAO).

Although, i dont believe that this forming of hydrogen bondings occurs very precise and very "tidy" thus leaving a part of the molecules vulnerable to MAO.

If this theory is right (which i'm quite sure) this would mean that MAOI leads to more psilocin/-cybin uptake.

 

[maxfreakout]

imho, this is not quite an answer, it's more like some blah blah blah about MAOI and shrooms and then an extraction method for rue.
not a word about the mechanism behind MAOI + Shrooms.

GOD is claiming that MAOI's don't potentiate shrooms, here is what Jamesw Kent has to say:

Taking a few grams of Syrian Rue forty minutes prior to ingesting psiloc(yb)in mushrooms will effectively double the potency of the mushrooms. The presence of the MAO-inhibitor potentiates the mushroom trip in a synergistic way and produces stare of consciousness which, in my opinion, more closely resembles the DMT state than your average mush- room trip (if there is such a thing as an "average" mushroom trip). I have found Psilocybe cubensis to be extremely reactive to the presence of an MAO-inhibitor, but this biochemical transformation should work magic with any species of Psilocybe mushroom - which, despite prohibition, are still widely available through home cultivation, cattle pastures, and woods and lawns around the globe

Not a single one of the various sources that GOD has cited even mention the combination of rue and shrooms


i conclude that GOD is an idiot

 

[Meduzz]

and who is James Kent anyway?
ihmo he's not an authority