Why are psychedelics so two sided?

[RushNerd]

From what I've experienced and read psychedelics are very... "two sided". You can go insane OR you can realize universal truths and become more enlightened?

i think that these ^ are actually one and the same thing, to go insane IS to become enlightened

the two-sidedness is more in the fact that you can have a glowing blissful good trip, or a hellish traumatic bad trip

Good point. Maybe being enlightened is really just the same as going crazy, only when you're going crazy, you haven't been prepared for being enlightened!

When you have an "enlightening" experience under drugs, that could also mean you had a very strong one. We know from experience that dissociatives and psychedelics will profoundly alter our thought patterns (even to resemble that of someone with a neurological disorder). And sometimes it will phase between good and bad, but the whole time we are learning.

While under the drug, you may also make many discoveries and find enlightening thoughts, but soberly looking back, you have an equal amount of ground to reflect upon.

No one obviously can be truly grateful for something as "simple" as liner, non-distracting sanity/thought and intact ego, until we take a journey without them.

 

[Kai]

i think that these ^ are actually one and the same thing, to go insane IS to become enlightened

Maybe everyone's crazy and to go 'insane' is to become sane and you only appear 'insane' to the majority?
...just a thought.

 

[????????]

i think that's about it, yes

 

[IJesusChrist]

Psychedelics enhance mineral ions "electricity" in the brain and elsewhere, they reinforce the bond to the matrix, unless you manage the lucidity to follow me into the garden, then we'll have a talk about how that came to be.

YEAH? Mineral ions electricity. ...
YUP.

So chemistry is now changing physics? You should present your findings to the nobel laureates, maybe they can help you get a seat!! :lol: :roll:

Kai - Yes. That's probably what "crazy" from psychadelics is. However, and this is grim: I personally feel that those that see the deepest truths don't make it out alive. I'm searching for the opposite spectrum, the lighter side of trips - personally am taking a break cause I can't handle the "insanity" at this stage :?

 

[st.bot.32]

I personally feel that those that see the deepest truths don't make it out alive. I'm searching for the opposite spectrum, the lighter side of trips

Honestly, I've seen nothing dark or sinister in the deepest 'truths' psychedelics teach. What you get out of them comes from your life experience and perspective. They can take one to very uncomfortable places that one might not be ready for at the time. Too much information while too inexperienced in life to know how to deal with it. (eg. Maybe psychedelics make some people reflect on aspects of their human mortality a bit earlier in life than they otherwise would have.)

The thing is, psychedelics don't necessarily "free" minds. They can reinforce existing delusions and existing stupidity. It's up to the user to know thyself, to put aside one's ego and think critically, to choose how to focus your mind, and choose your set and setting..

So going for the lighter side of trips, that's a great idea and worth doing. When you can observe self-depreciating and nihilistic thoughts from another perspective.. allowing yourself to see the amount of bullshit that is in them, then you're getting somewhere IMO. it's very much like waking up--once awake you can move onto greater things you never dreamed were possible. and suddenly you realize that your own "truth" is highly relative.. it changes with experience

 

[IJesusChrist]

I honestly don't know why I wrote that.

I find a problem of mine is that when I look to the future, it looks bleak. Not because it is, but that is for some fucked up reason how I'm wired. Usually psychadelics take place in the now, however when I look to the future on psychadelics it accelerates me right to the end of existance and bam. Theres nothing. The problem is, first few trips thats all I took out.

Anyways, disregard my negative posts, I'm usually in my negative state of mind when I put those (happens when I'm up late).

But I will continue to search for the "love" and connectedness trips. They seem to elude me under influence. Hell, I guess I have to realize it when I'm sober a bit first though huh.

Oh, one more thing. If there is ANYTHING I'm going to keep from the book "2012 return of quetzacoutl" it's going to be the hinduist views:
Live in the now, do not project your meanings on an empty future.

 

[st.bot.32]

when I look to the future, it looks bleak.

there's nothing wrong with that. i believe that any thinking, feeling human being is going to have periods of difficulty in their life, how can you not--the real world is often dark and oppressive. i've gone through long shitty periods lasting years. i bet there's a few other people here who have too

things WILL get better with time though, this is actually true. also having gone through a difficult period you learn things you can use to help others... like how to listen and empathize, without being naive

also it's funny you mention that, i did psychedelics for quite some time before I ever got the "connectedness" feeling. in the end it was quite different than I expected. it was more of a strong feeling of empathy that came about after I reached certain conclusions

 

[Ahuaeynjxs]

They wont give me a seat if my insight renders half past nobel prizes obsolete now, will they

 

[maxfreakout]

i think that these ^ are actually one and the same thing, to go insane IS to become enlightened

Maybe everyone's crazy and to go 'insane' is to become sane and you only appear 'insane' to the majority?
...just a thought.

yes i totally agree

there's a wonderful quote by Jan Svankmajer at the beginning of the film 'lunacy' which says something like:

there are two ways to run a lunatic asylum, each equally extreme. One encourages absolute freedom. The other, the old-fashioned, world tried method consists of control and punishment. But there is also a third one, that combines the very worst aspects of the other two. And that is the madhouse world which we live in today.

:twisted:

 

[Forkbender]

i think that these ^ are actually one and the same thing, to go insane IS to become enlightened

Maybe everyone's crazy and to go 'insane' is to become sane and you only appear 'insane' to the majority?
...just a thought.

I don't think this is true. There are different types of insanity and I find it hard to find enlightenment in the type that thinks they are Julius Caesar ruling the galaxy from the mental institution. Becoming 'enlightened' surely has to do something with letting go of the normal patterns (one of many definitions of sanity), but that doesn't mean insanity.

 

[Brugmansia]

^ Jep. It is more humility and founded respect for the creatures we are, as opposite to the persons one thought we were with all a differentiated name tag.

Part of this is that the occurrence of enlightment uncovers the softened codes and tender identity within oneself. As well as the awareness every one carries this core, with full blown ignorance. Anything is possible, with no reason for dishonesty here. A fair swap of mutual energy which will not distort the collective balance to serve the individual greed.

But with sorrow, I realise I have to stick to the boundries that exist, which is partly a deserted seat, knowing that many of mankind will continue with the march as it goes. So, the sensorial life is drinked as a beautiful dream alone. Though I managed it to pass on an unbiased attitude and general compassion on some in my environment.

In the long-term, relatively lower dosages are even sufficient to go through the entire revival again, all psychedelics do have a sort of negative tolerance.

 

[restin]

maybe madness is enlightenment that is on a lost way?

 

[Ahuaeynjxs]

I'd rather say that its enlightenment which has been unbalance, a.k.a the body have not been given enough time or nutrients to update its systems.

Thats a strong warning to wannabe enlighteners... if your body dosen't ascend with your mind, you're a schism, and are so pathetic that I will even change subjects.

I will make a post about what is my ideal day in this section, and you will see what I mean perhaps, I could all day long just eat and exercise to ascend, and you would think I'm some fatass who eats way too much, but I have 3% underskin fat and most people think I'm too thin ; where is all this energy going ? My guts and my brains... for a very peculiar reason ; long term balanced stature growth !

 

[maxfreakout]

I don't think this is true. There are different types of insanity and I find it hard to find enlightenment in the type that thinks they are Julius Caesar ruling the galaxy from the mental institution. Becoming 'enlightened' surely has to do something with letting go of the normal patterns (one of many definitions of sanity), but that doesn't mean insanity.

it's not just a case of 'going insane', rather it is experiencing insanity alongside sanity, and being able to integrate and understand BOTH states of consciousness in terms of each other. The kind of delusional, Julius Caesar state results from having too much of the insane state and not being able to integrate it properly