Some drugs are better than others.

[Forkbender]

Recently I was tripping with a friend and we somehow ended up talking about heroin. I said I wasn't really interested in trying it and he bounced back the question "How do you know, have you tried it?". I, of course, didn't know a proper answer and thanked him for his response. I noticed a prejudice about some drugs in my mind and started letting go. He hadn't tried it himself, but he didn't exclude the possibility that he would.

My friend told me he did a course in university on how drugs work in the brain. Apparently even with so called openminded drug users, there is a prejudice against some drugs. He told me the raw facts about heroin. Some people don't like it and even get a physical response. Others like it and try it once in a while without getting addicted. Only 3 (!) percent get hooked after trying it. A whopping 97 percent either stops using it after a while or doesn't like it at all. What do you guys think? Are some drugs better than others?

And what do you think about the users? Are people who do heroin or pcp or crystal meth necessarily bad? Or do they have an improper mindset for spiritual development? Or is this another prejudice?

 

[braha_kahn]

I voted :Yes, there are drugs that I will never touch, because they are bad.

But there's a chance that I'm wrong and that the problem lies with the user and not with the subtance...

 

[Caduceus Mercurius]

I do not want to experience how pleasurable heroin is, except perhaps at the very end of my life. Same for cocaine. I do not want to know what it is like to be that euforic, especially not from such substances. So rather than the harmfulness of these substances or their danger of addiction, what's really keeping me from trying them is that I think their effects will be too pleasurable.

 

[Forkbender]

Are you afraid you will become addicted?

BTW I know enough people who tried coke and found it as boring as doing groceries (while not high). I don't know anyone personally who has tried heroin. Or maybe I don't know who did. The stigma seems to be bigger on heroin than on coke.

 

[Lion]

I voted :Yes, there are drugs that I will never touch, because they are bad.

But there's a chance that I'm wrong and that the problem lies with the user and not with the subtance...

heroine-addiction is not because of the substance.
well, on a certain matter it does. cuz you choose to take it yourself. but i think (as i heard and read) one hit is enough to fukk you up

 

[Brugmansia]

Educating a lot about a substance and visualising it's effects and compare it with your own self within a honest perspective, definitely can tell whether you like it or not. So the argument 'you'll have to try is first to know' is clearly twaddle.

But to know the feeling of the intoxication itself of course, that can be only known as true knowledge if tried. But if one wants to know whether the substance suits him or not, he doesn't neccisarily have to try it to find out since reading a lot documentation, and gained self-knowledge throughout life, may provide this answer already.

I wouldn't talk as in terms of better from an objective view. I can understand very well that (capitalistic) people do enjoy cocaine, heroin and benzo's very much. And that a life from birth till death with closed doors is the absolute way to go for some individuals.

True, it's not a favor to their health at all and we psychonauts are much more susceptible and accessible for senses and aspects of life. But they'd turn into an insane being if they are going to follow and explore our path. They can't find the grip to integrate the spiritual stream within themselve. While this goes just naturally for us, we may not forget that some people are just not naturally inclined to it.

I do believe myself that users of opiates, cocaine, meth and PCP etc can be perfectly sane and healthy. But they'll have to abide by the narrow rules that apply to these substances. The human brain adapts any behaviour as accepted if one crosses the line with using these.

It's essential that one maintains with the connection of his own self while being high on narrow-minded drugs. Since these drugs do have a powerful ability to take over the control seat within the brain.

I did enjoy cocaine in limited amounts for about 3 years and experienced only the positive effects of it, I never lost the thought of how exceptionally beautiful mind-expanders are, what they brought me out of myself, and how minor the effects of coke are compared to it. But coke provided me some additional sides of me where I took lessons out of it, too. I learned how to debate with sharp sides to defend myself, which I wouldn't have done that drastic if I had never taken cocaine. It's sometimes useful in today's world.

Tried crack to get to know the intoxination, I know where my heart lies and why I wouldn't let the substance infiltrate with the indoctrination on my soul. In fact, I did not try to enjoy the effect by letting it go. But inhaled the base and analysed it's effects immediately. That was the whole intention. As predicted, it was exactly the opposite of who I am.

Can't obtain any quality H, but I'd chase the dragon if I could find it. With the same mindset as above.

As a general overview, I'd have to say a huge majority of those who're doing narrow-minded drugs in the long-term are experiencing a change in their behaviour at least. But I suppose if someone is sane enough to balance with narrow-minded drugs (which I believe is possible), there ain't much obstacles either to practise psychonautism.

 

[JustinNed]

^ +1

 

[Icelus]

I've read somewhere that you will start getting withdrawal symptoms of heroine use only after two weeks of daily use (multiple times a day). Before you start using heroine like this your quality of life should be very bad i guess...
The first "addiction" is only in the mind. But i can understand that some people who are not happy with their life easily develop a routine of daily use...

I think there is not much to learn from these substances (heroine and cocaine), but maybe i'm wrong. I am open to try them somewhere in my life, but only if i can ever get 100 % pure cocaine or heroine

 

[Caduceus Mercurius]

Are you afraid you will become addicted?

No, I'm afraid all future experiences in normal life will pale in comparison. I'm afraid such peak experiences will diminish my appreciation for life in general, including sex, meditation and psychedelic ecstacy.

 

[restin]

I don't believe that addiction is only in the mind. The one who says that was never really addicted (I never reeeeally was eather). The day after I smoked too much nicotine (!) cigarettes (weekend e.g.) I really feel the need to smoke more (I can taim it, luckily). What I fear most on H is the Overdose. And I could never ever give myself a fix. Never. It is something I really hate. But never say die, I do not say that I will never take H in my life but not now. I am also not interested in coke.

 

[Forkbender]

I don't believe that addiction is only in the mind. The one who says that was never really addicted (I never reeeeally was eather). The day after I smoked too much nicotine (!) cigarettes (weekend e.g.) I really feel the need to smoke more (I can taim it, luckily).

That could be psychological. Yes, addiction can be a problem, but there are no drugs that make you addicted first time you try it.

You can also smoke heroin, instead of shoot it. Pretty common for heroinusers here in Holland.

 

[Jahvisions]

The only drugs I would never try are the ones really unhealthy like sniffing glue, PCP or anything.

I don't think that heroin is very unhealthy and you must already have some problems if you get addicted to that. I have some experience with opiates but it was not more euphoric then mdma or the total bliss of a psychedelic experience. Cocaine wasn't actually really euphoric also but very subtile that's why i believe people become addicted, because it feels so innocent. These experiences where nice to give it try but the side effects are not word it.

 

[druglessdouglas]

ive never tried DMT. ive done a load of heroin and coke and ive smoked crack.

i think you have to put a bit of effort into becoming addicted. heroin is quite nice but i wouldnt put any effort into geting it. coke and crack make me iritable and a little angry.

amphetamine was the drug that hooked me though it was more psychological than physical. more accurately it was alcohol and amphetamine i liked (like still)

most hard drug addicts are self medicating IMO, usually they have an underlying mood disorder and get relief from street drugs.

i must clarify though. heroin and crack/coke cause a lot of misery where i live. its everywhere along with the crimes commited in order to make money to pay for it. you cant blame a chemical for the actions of people who want it though

edit: havnt done coke for a couple of years, and havnt touched heroin in almost 10

 

[Psychoid]

I do not want to experience how pleasurable heroin is, except perhaps at the very end of my life. Same for cocaine. I do not want to know what it is like to be that euforic, especially not from such substances. So rather than the harmfulness of these substances or their danger of addiction, what's really keeping me from trying them is that I think their effects will be too pleasurable.

I'm talking about personal experience here...

You would be disappointed by cocaine's effects... it really is not that good, it's good, nothing more... I find it easy to just take it once in a while when there's a good opportunity and I have the possibility of buying some. But I never made even a slight effort to obtain some, I always bought some when it crossed my path. I'd never buy cocaine in a bar, as you end up with a powder containing 10% of cocaine if you're lucky...
I have a good source that can provide me with ~80% pure cocaine. Costs me 10$ per 0.1g, 90$ for a gram. But I am high for 2 hours with .2g, and with bar-quality cocaine you would be high for like 30 min with the same quantity, and perhaps end up being high on something else. But I still think it's too expensive for the effect it provides...

But I'm not a fan of stimulants ^^

 

[Meduzz]

A molecule can't be evil or bad. But when you introduce it in a system it has certain effects that can be good or bad. It all depends on your system, your mindset. Just like people who feel insecure can get seriously hooked on cocaine or amphetamines, while others don't like them, as mentioned above.

Personally I've never done cocaine in my life. I have been offered some on several occasions but I already have to fight my big ego when I'm sober. :roll:

 

[JustinNed]

That could be psychological. Yes, addiction can be a problem, but there are no drugs that make you addicted first time you try it.

I would like to say that Methampetamines can be quite addicting after the first usage, especially if it's pure. Once you have been up tweaking for 12-24+ hours and you haven't eaten or slept and you are in such a bad mood that the only thing that will make you feel better if more meth.

I feel I've now learned to supress or control my addictions, only enjoying in them very moderately and safely. I'm proud to say the only drug I'm addicted to is marijuana. Oh, and maybe caffiene.

 

[Forkbender]

It can be addicting, but yet there are people who only try it once or twice or a dozen of times.

Another thing, that might sound a little too easy, but you have to take a drug more than once to show addictive behaviour.

My point is that people get addicted to a feeling (or lack thereof), not to a drug. This feeling is something they lack in their day to day life and they think the drug can provide that feeling (or lack thereof). Drugs can give a feeling that is so good that certain people want to take it again and again. Yet most people don't. Addiction starts in the mind before it gets physical.

 

[restin]

Yes, of course. But many people are not just happy. It is hard to say if you are profoundly happy or just simulating ot or so. Some people here meditate etc. but out in the real world there is a lot of misery suppressed by normal people. And it is very hard to control ones mind...

 

[IJesusChrist]

Meth is not a good drug, nor heroine, I will not say anything about PCP but it has a very negative connotation to it.

Out of all of these I would say I would never in my life touch meth, simply because the background it is associated with, the dirtyness it becomes synthesized from, and how gay the trips sound on it.
Heroine I would not take because pain killers I have no attraction to what so ever, percacets and loratabs just make me extremely irratable.
PCP seems like it has just as dirty of a name as meth, but even without I have no reason to try it, it seems like just a giant body high with a mind fuck.

I would have to say, without taking all of them, these are the "best drugs" taken iin moderation and intelligently of course:
X, DMT, CID, and maybe shrooms, although I always have lasting depression after taking them. (I still need to try acid and x...)

 

[Dreamsters]

I personally have not done heroine, but it "destroyed" my family when I was younger according to my mother. I watched my father be hooked on the chemical for years. I haven't seen him in many years now though, apparently he is back in the military so perhaps he's clean. I myself, I will do anything once except heroine only because of the immense amount of fear I have caused by that stuff. It takes all types of people to make the world go around. People are going to do what ever allows them to escape/ enjoy there time.