oui c'est juste c'est au début du mémoire... j'ai lu ça et puis j'ai poursuivi à la recherche de la toxicomanie mais on parle bien de cancer et de certaines maladies sans plus...
même si pour la question de l'anti stress il n'y a pas de doute et ton lien le démontre... excuses moi d'avoir été impatient Burned. En lisant ce que tu as donné j'ai quand même appris "l'ethymologie" chimique de la marque Redoxon
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je rassemble mes billes des 4 coins du forums dans ce nouveau sujet de la vitamine C... ce sont de simples copier-coller
The Hallucinogens par A. Hoffer, H. Osmond
Voir la pièce jointe 18099
ce fragment illustré du livre explique que la vitamine C est bonne pour le trippeur. C'est un élément de RdR.
Il y a déjà ça mais le plus important des témoignages je dois le retrouver.
la recherche sur internet est une histoire de fou et je ne trouve plus (pas encore) ce que j'avais vu un jour qui explique bien l'incidence de la vitamine C sur le trip de LSD. Je n'ai pas gardé le lien du treath en question pck j'étais à autre chose et maintenant qu'il me le faut je ne l'ai plus bien sûr. Ce web me fait chier magistralement...
mais il y a aussi ce texte que fort probablement beaucoup connaissent. Je ne lis pas bien l'anglais mais je crois que on montre là un mec high en LSD et bien équipé en vitamine C qui affronte un bar de marines américains où on gueule pour chanter et où on bat la mesure en tapant des poings sur les tables un jour de fête nationale. C'est pas ça??...
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~A study in the 1970's examined a large group of chemicals for an immunizing agent to protect people against the effects of LSD. The study checked over 200 compounds and found only two with significant prophylactic effects (i.e., that created a tolerance to LSD).
The most effective one was LSD itself. Nothing developed a tolerance to LSD better than the drug itself.
The other was Vitamin C, which ameliorated the confusion associated, often, with LSD. The researches commented strongly on the alteration of the effect: people who pre-treated with Vitamin C "tripped" but were less inclined to "get lost" in the experience and apparently maintained a less conspicuous social poise. (The potency of the LSD was also somewhat reduced, but this did not account for the _qualitative_ difference in the experience for these people, according the researchers.)
The study didn't relate the dosages or interval between Vitamin C and LSD administration. However, the "street knowledge" about this is: 1. The Vitamin C can prevent (sort of) the LSD experience if they are consumed together, especially if the Vitamin C dose is large (1 gram or more). A sort of mild up-and-down experience can result from this combination
2. Taking the Vitamin C two hours before LSD works well.
3. Taking enough Vitamin C to saturate the tissues works well if enough time is allowed (2 hrs., perhaps less).
4. The LSD effect is slightly weaker, quantitatively speaking, than without Vitamin C, and ends sooner too.
5. It's typically easier to sleep afterwards also.
6. The "sense" of time, and of distances, is less disturbed with also.
3 grams of Vitamin C will saturate most people's bodies well. A good method of eating this much C without gastric discomfort is to drink a solution of 3 grams of buffered Vitamin C that is dissolved (not just stirred into!) in a glass of water. (People who keep their bodies saturated with Vitamin C may notice that their urine is colored a brilliant yellow color. This is normal.)
It's possible that a smaller dose of Vitamin C will have the same effect on LSD effects; a half-gram tablet might be sufficient for example. However,a significant time delay will still be required before taking LSD.
I suspect that the "confusion" that Vitamin C reduces is actually very valuable for death-rebirth religious experiences; it's not a "bad side-effect" of LSD, in other words. However, such confusion makes an LSD user very vulnerable to "head-trips" and other dangers (that may occur either inside or outside of a "controlled setting"). There seems to be less of the amphetamine-like edginess of LSD in this combination; and I suspect the difference is not just the result of acidic urine washing the body clear of an exogenous amine.
The Vitamin-C ameliorated LSD experience sounds a lot like that ascribed to LSD analogues (such as the di-allylamide) although the potency is only slightly less than plain-vanilla LSD. For example, visiting a badly maintained, nudie-strip bar favored by US Marines on the 4th of July in a border town near Camp Pendelton would (for an experienced LSD user) be practical on the Vitamin C-LSD combination; the same situation might be unendurable otherwise. Likewise, law-enforcement personnel will notice a difference in poise, but they will not necessarily feel threatened by it.
Incidentally, ingesting LSD dissolved into (chlorine-free) water will smooth the introductory phase of the experience (regardless of Vitamin-C pre-treatment); LSD taken on paper tends, otherwise, to start very abruptly
So I guess we were both wrong, but still Vitamin C does apparently lengthen it while at the same time mellowing the trip out (getting rid of paranoia apparently) if administered in the right time frame before a trip
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~peut-être aussi que le sens de ce treath s'interprète différemment avec des cachets de vitamine C de 1000 mg ou des ampoules pour intraveineuses..? Qui a déjà fait ou vu un shoot de vitamine C régulateur de l'endocrine lors d'un bad par exemple? Pas moi mais je trouve ça étrange de ne pas pouvoir essayer au moins une x quand il n'y a pas supplément de risque.
Voir la pièce jointe 18100
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http://orthomolecular.org/resources/omns/v10n14.shtml
là on encense la vitamine C mais cela n'a rien à voir avec le sujet... on y apprend quand même que ==> "...Toutefois, tous ces patients ont reçu des perfusions de 50 grammes (50 000 mg) de vitamine C administrée en continu avant, pendant et après les séances de soins dentaires.... etc"
on fait donc des intraveineuses de 50 Gr de vitamines C !!! Cela n'a plus rien à voir avec les cachets effervescents... On commence à aborder un volet différent de la question non?? ptn on trouve le secret de Mick Jagger !!
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toujours rien sur le LSD <===> AA (acide ascorbique) et pourtant j'essaie de trouver mais par contre un petit quelque chose de sérieux à votre analyse au sujet de la MDMA
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Here's the results of a study (done on rats mind you). What it basically says is that Vitamin C (Ascorbic Acid) reduced the depletion of Serotonin by MDMA, so therefore the peak is reduced. However, the flip side of that is, if you took the Vit C few hours after you drop, there's a theoretical possibility that you'll reduce the neurotoxicity (my theory)
Authors
Shankaran M. Yamamoto BK. Gudelsky GA.
Institution
College of Pharmacy, University of Cincinnati, Cincinnati, Ohio 45267-0004, USA.
Title
Ascorbic acid prevents 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA)-induced hydroxyl radical formation and the behavioral and neurochemical consequences of the depletion of brain 5-HT.
Source
Synapse. 40(1):55-64, 2001 Apr.
Abstract
MDMA-induced 5-HT neurotoxicity has been proposed to involve oxidative stress due to increased formation of hydroxyl radicals. Recently, MDMA-induced 5-HT neurotoxicity has been shown to be accompanied by a suppression of behavioral and neurochemical responses to a subsequent injection of MDMA. The intent of the present study was to examine whether suppression of the MDMA-induced formation of hydroxyl radicals by an antioxidant, ascorbic acid, attenuates both the MDMA-induced depletion of 5-HT and the functional consequences associated with this depletion. Treatment of rats with ascorbic acid suppressed the generation of hydroxyl radicals, as evidenced by the production of 2,3-dihydroxybenzoic acid from salicylic acid, in the striatum during the administration of a neurotoxic regimen of MDMA. Ascorbic acid also attenuated the MDMA-induced depletion of striatal 5-HT content. In rats treated with a neurotoxic regimen of MDMA, the ability of a subsequent injection of MDMA to increase the extracellular concentration of 5-HT in the striatum, elicit the 5-HT behavioral syndrome, and produce hyperthermia was markedly reduced compared to the responses in control rats. The concomitant administration of ascorbic acid with the neurotoxic regimen of MDMA prevented the diminished neurochemical and behavioral responses to a subsequent injection of MDMA. Finally, a neurotoxic regimen of MDMA produced significant reductions in the concentrations of vitamin E and ascorbic acid in the striatum and hippocampus. Thus, the MDMA-induced depletion of brain 5-HT and the functional consequences thereof appear to involve the induction of oxidative stress resulting from an increased generation of free radicals and diminished antioxidant capacity of the brain. Copyright 2001 Wiley-Liss, Inc.
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il me semble que on établit ici que l'AA (acide ascorbique) est en mesure de rendre la pareille à la neurotoxicité du la MDMA. Je n'ai pas encore trouvé pour le LSD ou l'héro mais il y a de fortes chances à parier que ce sera pareil. Et voila qui étaye la crédibilité de mon témoignage pour notre junkie du Vondel Park... et aussi qui rend hommage à sa mémoire.
