schitzopherina,COMT and cannabis

[viljo]

Im always waiting for new information to come out about schitzopherina and recently I came across an article about COMT. Its not a recent article it was published in 2005 but there is a reason for posting it.

i've tried to add the link but no luck when i checked it you need to google
Disruption of gene interaction linked to schizophrenia.

After reading about COMT and schitzopherina you might want to look at this site its about how cannabis can affect the defective gene COMT .

I can't post the link here, don't ask. I will post it though.

love to hear your thoughts about COMT and maby this is a reason why a small percentage claim that cannabis leads to psychossis and some answers to the debate.

hope you enjoy.

 

[viljo]

that's the second link about cannabis and COMT but once again after checking it no luck you need to google this one too.

Catalyst: Marijuana Madness - ABC TV Science

 

[Caduceus Mercurius]

Viljo, please read "Psychology of the Future" by Stanislav Grof, and then return to discuss the causes of any mental condition. No drug is capable of causing a mental illness. Drugs can only trigger or exacerbate symptoms.

Though not directly related to this subject, you could start by reading the citations in this thread.

 

[viljo]

Caduceus Mercurius you posted 30 seconds after I made the thread you have't even read anything.

I think you think its just another attack against cannabis.
read the information.

I'll read what you say to read but you could at lest read mine before posting.

 

[Caduceus Mercurius]

But I posted it several days after you wrote a very similar post. I tried clicking on your links, but they were dead. I then googled for "COMT cannabis" to understand what you were referring to.

I still see no links in your posts.

 

[Jeniger]

ABC :crybaby:
http://www.abc.net.au/catalyst/stories/2402434.htm
come on, that video is too sad for words....

what is your point?

u believe this stuff?

 

[viljo]

Caduceus Mercurius I posted links but when I checked them they didn't work you were so quick to reply I never got a change to fix them.

this post is much different to my last post it talks about the COMT gene and is another path to the cause of schitzopherina it also talks about how the defective gene COMT is further affected by cannabis.

my recent posts really gave no evidence so I put more work into this post.

 

[Caduceus Mercurius]

"And the critics had a good point. If cannabis caused psychosis, how come as consumption increased over the years, schizophrenia rates hadn’t? But it turned out no one had really checked. In 2004, a London study found the truth – schizophrenia rates have been rising in parallel with cannabis use."

Schizophrenia rates? Based on which criteria?

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia:

"Diagnosis is based on the patient's self-reported experiences and observed behavior. No laboratory test for schizophrenia currently exists."

"Due to the many possible combinations of symptoms, there is debate about whether the diagnosis represents a single disorder or a number of discrete syndromes. For this reason, Eugen Bleuler termed the disease the schizophrenias (plural) when he coined the name."

"Part of a larger controversy over biopsychiatry, the validity of schizophrenia as a diagnostic entity has been criticised by number of psychologists as lacking in scientific validity and diagnostic reliability.[22][23] In 2006, a group of patients and mental health professionals from the UK, under the banner of Campaign for Abolition of the Schizophrenia Label, argued for a rejection of the diagnosis of schizophrenia based on its heterogeneity and associated stigma, and called for the adoption of a bio-psychosocial model. Other UK psychiatrists opposed the move arguing that the term schizophrenia is a useful, even if provisional concept.[24][25]"

And from The Psychedelic Salon, podcast 188:

"One of the things that’s so striking about shamanism in the native context is the absence of mental illness." - McKenna

 

[Jeniger]

Terence Mckenna - Schizophrenic or Shamanic?

U can demand us to read ur suggestions, but if u are not willing to look at other information debating is quiet useless

 

[viljo]

im not demanding anyone to read my information but I do think if your going to reply a general understanding of what the topic is about is needed, im more then happy to read other peoples view that's why I posed in the first place.


too Caduceus Mercurius, thank you for your thoughts sounds like you know a lot and I will research your information more and maby get back to you on that.

 

[IJesusChrist]

Why is it that whenever anyone says there is the possibility that drugs can have bad effects the oldies on here get very defensive?

Why can't you guys accept that drugs even marijuana can have negative side-effects.

It will be funny when they find a link between schizophrenia and cannabis, maybe this COMT is it. I definitely believe that these things can cause severe mental disorders.

Pulling the "The drugs only uncover hidden defects" is useless. Well no fucking shit, but the drugs do the only action to uncover and activate the disorder. Whatever its action may be, the drug is the cause.

Now - it is rare. It doesn't happen much, most people smoking cannabis just simply get "high" but there are those, like me previously, that would smoke, and would be completely tossed into something else. Like you're no longer you.

Sorry for being blatant but fuck it, I'm fine 5 minutes before I smoked, 5 minutes after I would be on a roller coaster trying to distinguish reality and what my mind was simply covering up. Its scary shit, and weed (possibly shrooms) alone did it. I can say that with the upmost certainty.

 

[Jeniger]

No one is defending anything...
No one claims they cannot give a bad effect, but if a person afther doing a long time of research has completely loose their trust in labeling of all the mental illnesses and sees the world from a more shamanistic/native point of view, this story is more a small side of the story with a reality only consisting in our system/reality.

So lets pretend i believe in mental disorders:
If it is the case that schizophrenia is linked to COMT, what do we have more than just a scientiffic chemical explanation?

I cannot understand the importancy

 

[viljo]

I thought the importance of finding a scientific reason for the cause of schitzopherina is obvious, a cure. To have the ability to function normally in society and no longer suffer.

in all truth this forum has calmed me down a lot, when I first joined I was arrogant about cannabis and psychossis. im just passionate about why it has happened to me and the truth behind it, whether cannabis is even remotely responsible or not I search for the answers.

I thought some might be interested in COMT.

 

[BrainEater]

lol... funny how everybodys always sort of seems to try to push their arguments through in a way, regardless whether the other listens or not ... or well they don't seem to notice or care about that ..

i don't know... this boy just fkn pathetic... so weak really and first time something happens to him yeah it's the bad marijuana and yeah everythings confirmed by scientists, yeah just whatever you say mate .... he can believe whatever he tells himself and think it's the truth obviously LOL...

i mean he's not wrong in a way in being convinced of what he is being convinced... but he seemingly doesn't recognize that the drug just showed him what is going on in a very dark corner of his mind or just bringing this part into the "light of his consciousness or somethin like that"...

what i wanna say is that the drug cannot be demonized in this way, because the psychosis in itself is in you and not in the drug, so the drug can't really be the cause.... more somethin like a trigger as Caduceus Mercurius already pointed out...

i am for more caring for what is really going on instead of talking bullshit and always finding the guilty ones etc or whatever buddies ..

gonna light myself a nice pipe now (only thing i'm concerned about there is my poor lungs ;( gotta take a break really of the baaad bad smoking or switch to vaporizing ... or eating hehe)

peace :weedman:

 

[Jeniger]

Viljo, can u tell us what u experienced when u had an psychosis?

also u might be interested in this video about psychosis, psychedelics,reality.

 

[viljo]

brain eater I think the comment you made towards me was nothing more than that of a pig.

Jeniger if you read Caduceus Mercurius post wikipedia schitzopherina it explains the symptoms very well and would be more interesting and accurate then what I could wright. but if you got any specific questions just ask.

 

[Jeniger]

"Diagnosis is based on the patient's self-reported experiences and observed behavior

Every indiviudal is so unique with it's "symptoms" that a wiki page will not justify to describe your psychosis.

Personally i think psychosis can be part of a spiritual awakening, wich can be a tough way but when u arrive at the other side, u are more enlightent. Why would u want a cure that prevents u from being enlighted and keep u numb.

To have the ability to function normally in society and no longer suffer.

I really get the creeps from that sentence , i would say it the other way around. When u begin to function "normally" it's hard to join this society

 

[viljo]

all schitzopherics experience the same symptoms, delusions, voices, subliminal messages, depression and anxiety . what differs is the uniqueness.

like my delusion might be about aliens and someone else might have a delusion about gods but there both delusions.

yeah I think your more enlightened from the experience but I think you lack the understanding of how ill it makes you. there is a big difference between enlightenment and so loony no one can make sense of what your saying. depression leads to hate and pity and suicide not happy and full of life its like your dead inside.

how can I control a serve chemical imbalance that never stops and go for a long period of time without some form of medication, soon enough I lose touch with reality.

it's so unpleasant its so difficult to concentrate,

 

[BrainEater]

lol viljo !!! the comment wasn't directed at you but at the dude in the video which was posted by Caduceus Mercurius....

peace

 

[mysticwarrior]

yeah I think your more enlightened from the experience but I think you lack the understanding of how ill it makes you. there is a big difference between enlightenment and so loony no one can make sense of what your saying. depression leads to hate and pity and suicide not happy and full of life its like your dead inside.

Read the words of the ancient mystic's, and then you will notice that civilizations, will often tell you that the enlighted person is a loony, instead of a wise man. Yet the enlighted person who is on the other side, doesn't care. Because he forgives the foolish man who is in a deep sleep.