What is pschedelic (I deeply apologize for asking.)

[Schwanke668]

I deeply apologize for asking about something that I am sure there have been whole books written on but my problem is that for reasons that I cannot currently understand I cannot curently 'understand' 'books'. I cant read things that are written to mass audiences. Books, pamphlets, the bible. Sometimes I can manage blog posts on websites but I think thats because its a smaller audience.

So I need a favor and the favor is for someone or multiple someones to explain to me 'directly' in a conversational style, what a 'psychedelic experience is'. I need to be able to ask questions and have a dialog with people who are willing to converse about it and not just point me to references.

Again I deeply apologize for this brokenness in me but I am who I am and I can be no one else.

If your offended by the idea of me not being able to 'look it up on my own' then please just ignore this post and if everyone ignores it then I will try to find some other way to figure out what I am trying to figure out.

...

I am asking the question because IJC was suggesting and I have no reason not to believe him that I am not having psychedelic experiences. He pointed me more in the direction of shamanistic experiences and based on my rudimentary understanding of what I was able to get out of the wikipedia and my wife walking me through it I can see the similarities though dont see myself as 100% in that direction.

Still like I am having this 'experience' that started when I smoked the Salvia 24 hours ago and hasnt stopped. Its gone up and down and I can almost visualize the waveform but still I have ins and outs and I am curious if I am having psychedelic snippets or am I misunderstanding something.

I guess what I dont believe is that a psychedelic experience is simply a chemical reaction that causes specific mind altered experiences. I believe that in the ever intense power of the spiritual world that any manifestation that can be caused by 'physical, scientific, or natural means' can also be caused by spiritual means. This having been said I dont see why you cant have psychedelic experiences of a spiritual nature having not taken any chemicals to cause them.

If you read my conversation with IJC you'll see I am going through a lot right now and am trying to figure things out, IJC even said in a fractal almost bake your noodle style self referential equation type deal that my mind NEEDS to figure it out and so I am struggling with that and will struggle with it.

Guess I am just asking for the favor of Johnny 5s "need more input" mentality on psychedelic equations so that I can process them into my databanks and try and understand both the micro and macro evolutionatory nature of my psychological progression.

Or something like that.

Frankly I like being like this but its kind of a 'what would people think if I was always like this' kind of way and I also always believe in moving forward so staying in any one place for too long is ultimate disaster.

Thanks either way and again if it offends you please just ignore me and the post will go away. (Kind of like our teeth.)

 

[Jamapricotica]

This post has been edited by me, Jamapricotica, for the simple reason that I am attempting to cleanup and/or improve my presence on this forum.

Sorry for any inconveniences this may cause.

 

[Jamapricotica]

This post has been edited by me, Jamapricotica, for the simple reason that I am attempting to cleanup and/or improve my presence on this forum.

Sorry for any inconveniences this may cause.

 

[IJesusChrist]

Psychodelic is tracers, waves, intense emotions, trailing thoughts, examining and critical thoughts induced by a psychodelic drug.

It can also pertain to anything that resembles the use of psychodelics.

 

[Schwanke668]

Ok thank you both.

For Jamapricotica's response I often find it convenient in my thought life to 'reprogram' my mind. What I do is I create markers that indicate a certain mental state and then tie things into that state to trigger thoughts or memories at a later date. Kind of like mnemonics but at a more 'sub' level. Like if I need to remember to take something with me to the store i visualize the thing then I visualize the highest probable sequence of things that I will see prior to leaving for the store so that there is an extreme high probability that I will see these things and 'remember' the thing I am to take. I feel myself making conscious connections between the thing I wish to take and the things that I see so that as my day progresses the next day the build up of 'subconscious' reminders eventually triggers a conscious one. Like if I tied 10 things to 'bring my car keys' maybe after three or four of them the pile up almost remembering turns into remembering.

I used to do this as a child by say visualizing my front door and my calculator and then as I walked out the front door i would go "oh right, calculator".

Ive always done stuff like this, used to call it hacking my own brain. I put in 'sub routines' sometimes that I can only explain to myself that modify how I act but in a conscious controlled way with an awareness of the interactions of my psyche in the back ground.

Thats the best that I can describe that portion of my interaction with my own psyche, is that considered psychedelic? hacking your own brain? As opposed to relying on naturally occurring solutions?

Psychodelic is tracers, waves, intense emotions, trailing thoughts, examining and critical thoughts induced by a psychodelic drug.

It can also pertain to anything that resembles the use of psychodelics.

Is the important part induced by a drug? What if these experiences are induced without the use of a drug? That was what was getting at with some of what we were discussing originally in that other thread.

Traces I'm not sure about but I was wondering if you meant trails, I get trails frequently.

Waves I dont exactly know how you mean, unless thats more of a visual thing.

Intense emotions, trailing thoughts, examining and critical thoughts, are all things that I do on a regular basis to greater or less degrees and the intensity and frequency and 'character' of these experiences change relative to other 'trippy' phenomenon.

For example I get what I call 'rolling blackouts' where I will 'wake up' as if from a dream and not remember what I was doing and then over the next 5 minutes or more begin to piece together what I was doing. I noticed that these rolling blackouts correlate strong with intense mental experiences where I am deep in analysis of myself and my surroundings and as such disconnect with the physical world at a conscious level but have an internal connection with the psychological/spiritual world.

I also get situations in which I can trace my psychological thought processes throughout the day looking at the memories that spawn from my interaction with realty as well as comparing the synchronicities throughout the day and processing them at a more macro level.

I for example have noticed the high number of times that my car's odometer has stopped on a repeating number in the driveway or at a parking lot. My favorite was 177777. I also have have had a case of all 8s and 0s except for the 1 at the front of the 100,000 across both odomoters. I also have combinations of 3636 etc etc. I have photos of the 7s and 8s but the others were so frequent I was freaking out my mom lol.

I often find for example that if I pay attention to these sequences and I can either post process or pre-process my day and have an inclination of an understanding of a higher order of relationships through my interaction with reality.

I can for example notice things such as the 'waveform' as I call it of which traffic lights I hit and dont hit on my regular routes and can use that information on the way too or from something to determine how best to interact with the environment that I am heading into. Whether its coming home and dealing with my home life or going to a store and dealing with the store.

Now this stuff with 'reading signs' I could see as being a part of the 'scrying' and so forth 'reading bones' for example mentioned in the shamanism Wikipedia page. But I have within the past 5 or so years been able to 'read' the signs of almost anything. I for example built my own scrying deck of cards out of magic the gathering cards because I find them the most virsitle for spelling out complex spiritual equations. I mark certain cards for certain people then tie personal relationships to the other cards. Some 6o to 80 of them, then shuffle split and deal through a combination of prayer and intuition and then I 'read them'. I have gotten nearly to the point of being able to influence reality through the cards such as being able to call up a particular card that I wanted by envisioning it and then shuffling and dealing the deck and being able to pull the card from the pile of unseen cards completely without any 'cheating' of any kind.

I am assuming that the scrying would not be considered psychedelic, yet I see it partially as 'intense analysis of thought' because I do so much heaving reading of the 'signs' of my day as a permanent running process in my mind that when I sit down to 'read a card' I am drawing from all of my memories from the day and the connections that I have made through observing them and tieing it all in together.

Keep in mind ive never had any actual interaction with tarot or any of the sort, I only noticed that several or so years ago when I was playing my own invention of solitaire I found that I was getting rather keen at predicting the cards in the deck even after a solid 7 hand shuffle. It creeped me out at first and I even showed my prayer ministry leader/mentor and she said it was interesting and unique and felt 'iffy' based on it being so close to tarot yet at the same time scripture makes reference to the urum and thurum which were effectively dice used for decision making so 'scrying' even under a Christian paradigm is not unheard of.

Maybe it doesnt really matter what I call these experiences except that I keep having the phrase 'psychedelic' bounce around in side my head so heavily that I feel as if its part of my growth at a spiritual and psychalogical level to understand it and come to grips with some form of relationship with it. I suspect that I am doing a lot more psychedelic things then I realize even under the proper definition of the phrase and that I am just conveying them rather poorly on this forum. On the other hand it may only be that since my largest spiritual experience was during a psyechedelic chemical overload that it may be akin to finding your salvation from a car crash and then thinking your supposed to be a car salesmen for the rest of your life lol.

Who knows. Thanks always for helpinging and sorry if I am starting to babble.

 

[HeartCore]

I am asking the question because IJC was suggesting and I have no reason not to believe him that I am not having psychedelic experiences.

Hint: psychedelic <=> shamanic, it's the same.

Don't take my word or IJC's wordt for it, ask a real shaman.

 

[Schwanke668]

I am asking the question because IJC was suggesting and I have no reason not to believe him that I am not having psychedelic experiences.

Hint: psychedelic <=> shamanic, it's the same.

Don't take my word or IJC's wordt for it, ask a real shaman.

How do I find one? lol. No really. I dont know the first thing about how you find one or figure out if they are 'real' or what not. I've learned from my other spiritual experiences you have to be really carefull who you take as your mentor and keeping an eye on whether or not your still benifiting from learning from them.

I wouldnt trust myself googling for a shamanistic website anymore then I would trust myself googling to find a surgeon or a dentist. Lots of quacks out there and sometimes you cant know until its too late. Much better to go on recomendation.

 

[IJesusChrist]

I was being blunt and honest with my first response, you can label whatever you are experiencing as whatever you like, but remember that has implications.

To find a real shaman you will have to either go to the countries that house them, or become part of an ayahuasca retreat group, or a travelling ayahuasca band (I have only heard of ayahuasceros and not of any psilocybin or mescalin shamans, but they exist aswell).

A real shaman will not be brought up under the society of you and I, and will have much less of the social, and unjustifiable, superficial tendencies we all hold. They will have a more pure thought of nature and the spirits.

Beyond that, rolling black outs are analogous (sp?) with a diagnosis of schizophrenia. This is a predicament indeed! As I have said before, the label of insanity will have you fearing what you hold, whereas the label of shaman, will have you endulging in it. I can say that the label of schizophrenia or a western diagnosis will only hinder what you hold, but to correctly label yourself as a neo-shaman (and I use that term for us in the industrial world only, due to the influences we hold) will be hard. An uneducated man to label himself as a genius will only find fault, to label yourself as some sort of shaman, will have you in question, and possibly false hope.

What I am saying is, at the present, you need to hold what you have in the neutral, until you become fully aware of how you control yourself. In how you can act, deal, and use your introspection and unveiling vantage points. I think what you hold is possibly (probably) the retention of the psychodelic landscape in your mind, such is your brain, mind, has created a route into which to tap into the same thought processes that the psychodelic's themselves hold. I, personally, attempted to fix it - in a way to get rid of it - as that saved my ability to cope with the city life.

You, however, seem much more able to utilize and be at peace with this phenomenon of the mind-brain. I think, before you get into the realm of western-magick "pick up some tarot cards at Mystic Wallys!" you should learn what it is really about and see an experienced shaman. I do not know how you will go about doing this, but I'd be jealous

 

[Schwanke668]

Well thank you this helps greatly. I personally believe that I have a solid relationship with Christ and so I will trust in him to lead me in the right direction. I guess in the end I can only have faith. I know that a faith like this is sometimes looked down upon in this types of situations but I also have a firm belief that Christ is a lot lot lot lot LOT weirder then most people give him credit for. The strange typo wacko tripped out funktastic SHIT that I have seen in my life and the lives of others over the past 10 years has sent me reeling sometimes. Yeah, he has his "Cliche Christian" as I call it interaction with most 'Christians' but then I think he DOES set aside some people where he likes to indulge the more 'arcane' portions of our global psyche/spirituality while still maintaining the core relationship which is a lot more 'softer' then the Cliche version.

I read somewhere on the internet a vague reference to Christian Shaman's and have a faith that its possible to be both. They described it as being a calling and I also see being a TRUE believer (as opposed to a cookie cutter make money fast beating everyone over the head with "Jesus is the Way" (tm) methodology) also being a calling and so being called to be both makes sense to me.

As for the idea of the idea of it being too early to embrace/label my experience as shamanism I have already placed in my psyche markers that allow me to stop and say "There is a sign post up ahead, next stop, The Twilight Zone" and these markers indicate that I am heading into territory that may or may not be fully confirmed and that I should proceed with extreme caution.

(Btw, thats exactly how my markers work. I use mostly movie and tv and pop culture references as 'markers' and 'echos' in my mind to trigger personal emotional and psychological responses. For example if in my own mind I AM going too far in a particular direction the twilight zone reference will pop into my conscious even if the thought that is getting me there is subconscious and I will go 'ok baby, hold on, time to take it slow, ease up on the throttle, level off, take a breather, regroup' etc.., in my flight pattern)

The number one overriding factor in all of this is trusting my 'future' in the sense that before this all began I had a belief/faith that everything will turn out the way it is supposed to and I still firmly believe that. Sure it may be rocky at times and filled with doubt and maybe even fear but in the end that fades and I return to a sense of calm and peace that everything is going "According to Plan."

With that having been said I'll have to figure out how to explore this possibly shamanistic experience without the possiblity of traveling to other cultures for the moment as that is highly unlikely. However God does work miracles so who knows, maybe he'll drop one in my lap or I'll pop out of know where into a time worm hole or something and meet one somewhere somewhen else. Who knows.

I am going to australia for a few years in here somewhere, maybe I can find one there, someone out in the bush maybe.

Such a crazy world we live in, might as well go insane to keep up I guess..

As always. Thanks!

 

[ophiuchus]

Now this stuff with 'reading signs' I could see as being a part of the 'scrying' and so forth 'reading bones' for example mentioned in the shamanism Wikipedia page. But I have within the past 5 or so years been able to 'read' the signs of almost anything.

specific medium's not necessary, it's a matter of preference, to get the mind into the mindstate easily. it can be done with anything however. (i've been researching this lately too)

 

[Schwanke668]

I always loose track of who is reading which threads or saying what on which thread because I kind of see Psychonaut.com as a collective consciousness and maybe I'll try harder but we were just discussing syncronicity in another thread and I think scrying and similar 'gifts' are just the ability to interpret syncronicities at a deeper level.

In one area your reading 'glaring related events'. Red car, red car, blue car, blue bike, will there be a red bike?

In another area your reading 'signs AROUND an event'. Things related to a particular red car and its occupants for example.

In the grand order of things they are all events just some are glaring and others are more subtle. Reading from a deck or from dice (which are called bones sometimes anyway) is all about reading the 'syncronicity' inside a closed medium. (This card, that card, their all cards.) Where as out in the world its a more open medium but might be 'this car that car' or 'this hat that hat' or 'this person's outfit, that person's outfit'. Its all about scrying off the mediums of 'cars' and 'outfits' as opposed to 'cards' and 'dice'. Reading beyond that is just crossing mediums. "This card" + "That Dice" + "That car" + "That outfit" means this. Picking one of each from four mediums is just as effective as four from the same medium as long as you can red the signs.

Signs, signs, everywhere signs, cant read this, cant read that, cant you read he signs?