what is beyond the psychonautic?

[Finarfin]

Psychonaut comes from the greek psyche that means soul/mind/spirit. And nautis which means sailor/navigator of the sea.
So a psychonaut is someone who is a sailor of the mind.
So as a psychonaut we are metaphorically speaking on a boat on the sea of our own mind.
Let me explain my question : What are we doing on this boat on the sea of the mind? Why are you (we) psychonauts/psychonauting.
Are we just aimlessly sailing the seas. Exploring inner space. Letting the currents take us where they may?
Or does this ship have a destination? Is this ship going to a harbor? is this ship looking for a way home, just like Odysseus was looking to return home to ithaka.

Psychonautica is going into the mind, exploring the mind. Going on a journey or a trip and experiencing all kinds of mind states/emotions/feelings.
When you go on a journey you will have encounters and you might learn things. It,s a great and adventures, just like Odysseus had a great adventure. It is what Joseph Campbell called the hero,s journey.
What happens when the journey is over? What happens when the trip end? Where does it leaves you (us)? Where do we end up?
What is it we hope to find when we go on a journey? What are we looking for when we look into the mind?
What is beyond psychonautics?

i think that beyond psychonautics there should (in the end) be transformation. What is the point of exploring the mind if there is no transformation? When there is no transformation it is just like taking psychedelics to trip out and have a good time. Maybe you go to a party and take psychedelics and dance all night. After the trip is over you,re still the same old you. You had a good time but nothing has changed.

So what do you think?

 

[Mavraek]

As much as I have tried, have not had breakthrough on the dmt. However, have been surfing my mind for nearly 45 years. I only can say, have faith, meditate on nothing and relax to the best of ability.

 

[Lotre]

Transformation will happen, whether we want it or not. Everything in the universe we live in is changing all the time. Even a pointless party dancing in a club brings something to the person doing it. But it can be frustrating to some persons, it can have a taste of waste and unacomplishment. I think psychonautic is about giving a purpose to these different states of mind. Maybe a work over time to gain more knowledge or control or anything one might want about his conscience and emotions. I like what one psychonaut said here, that he wanted to know the limits of his conscience. This is one of the things one could maybe encounter on his journey.

 

[Finarfin]

If psychonautism is hedonistic drug use then why do we call it psychonautism? I do not think there is something wrong with hedonism. However isn,t psychonautism more then hedonistic drug use? Drugs are just one way to explore the mind.

If it,s just drug use and nothing more. If after the trip you are just the same person and you did not change, what is the point of it all. Is there no difference between a psychonaut and someone who takes drugs or drinks to have fun. Psychonauting can be fun. And psychonauting is different from numbing or sedating yourself. And it,s different from taking drugs just to feel good isn,t it? Psychonautism is more then only drug use isn,t it?

Ofcourse transformation will always happen whether we want it or not. Transformation is the nature of this fractel energetic universe we inhabbit.

I personaly transformation beyond psychonautism. If you ask me what kind of transformation I think it,s a healing transformation. To open the doors of the emotions. To open up to the imagination. To open up to nature to love to the world. To heal yourself of neurosis.
and to start being creative.

This is how I see it. I do not believe you need drugs for this. However drugs can be usefull. Drugs when use to sedate can also work against opening the self. I think this path of self exploration and indivuation is a path full of traps and pitfalls.

 

[Finarfin]

And how about ayahuasca or iboga. I would not call it drugs that people only take for pleasure. It are no recreational drugs.

for some psychonautism maybe just another from of entertainment. I think these people are not real psychonauts but belong to the recreational users group. I think psychonautism should be more then mere entertainment.

 

[BrainEater]

maybe the psychonautic could be a way of going beyond, however not necessarily and then the question would be to go beyond what? i think the definition of psychonautic from finarfin is quite good. however i would say there can be all kinds of methaphorical stories or so. for example what about diving instead of sailing?? well i guess possibly, the idea of psychonautism could be related to the word psychological. perhaps that anything can be interpreted psychologically in its own way... can't explain it really well...

in principle psychonautism is something deep or at least potentially deep. maybe a bit like a direction... people that want to heal themselves, explore the inner and outer worlds/realms, expand their minds and find peace. maybe psychonauts can see higher logics more easily or more understandingly.
well also i guess it's like whatever works for you. maybe sometimes or for some people it works with no psychedelic substances at all and for others different...
i don't know i think the word psychonaut reminds me a bit of the word astronaut. i think it should be about exploring the outer space and the inner space in peaceful ways.



peace

 

[Finarfin]

I think the difference between psychonautism and recreation or entertainment is intention. The recreational user uses psychedelics for fun or hedonistic reasons. A psychonaut uses psychedelics (or other methods) to explore the mind.

With a book for example, You can read a book for fun or entertainment or to get something more out of it like learning something.

I think it is the intention (focus) that makes someone a psychonaut.

But why do psychonauts want to explore the mind? And what are they going to do when the mind is explored?

 

[SWIMchem5]

Transformation takes time. Psychedelics do, however, have medical properties at sub hallucinogenic or even common doses. The mind is very complex. Since the beginning of time, the few controlled the many using ethanol. Ethanol increases conformity over the course of generations and inhibits the anti-conformity that psychedelics try to induce. The transformation is usually not desired by society because they can sense the overwhelming negative emotions of others and see the ever-growing trend toward evil and stupidity. In short, people choose the blue pill over the red pill. Often, these two may cancel each other out. So any transformation achieved and passed on to the next generation can be botched by the next generations partaking in alcoholic beverages. The only excusable uses would be as a lab solvent, medicinal purposes, and use of a very small amount to combine with medicines for solubility purposes.

 

[Finarfin]

Swimchem5 please use your own thread if you are going to talk about the evils of alcohol

Please

 

[Lotre]

I don't want to enter the debate on alcohol here, especially because there's a new thread for that, and i don't wanna support alcohol in it's general use, but i just want to say that sometimes alcohol showed me things that i have tried to ignore and bury into my sub-conscious. So it has big psychonautic aspects too.

 

[badilo]

for the first month or two of taking psychedelics i was constantly thinking about whether or not it has changed me but personally i don't need feel it needs to lead to any place/ change. i have learned some thing's about myself during my time i have spent being a psychonaut, this is really what i want and i dont feel it has to lead me to something else, im happy where i am.

 

[Finarfin]

If you have learned somethings about yourself, what did you learn about yourself?
Did what you learned about yourself effected you? Did it change you in any way? Did it change your attitude, mood, way of thinking/being?

Being happy where you are is fine.
Does being happy mean there is no need for moving foward or developing yourself? Does the individuation proces stop when you are happy where you are?

so what happens when we have gone trough the individuation process?
What happens when we are happy where we are and find inner peace?
What is the next step.

I get the feeling that for some people psychonautism is about tripping out on psychedelics and nothing more.

 

[Finarfin]

Is there something wrong with tripping out on psychedelics: no there is nothing wrong with it. However psychonautism can be so much more then recreational drug use. It can be a whole way of living. With the right intention everything can be psychonautic. And it can be a way to transform the self, to move forwards. To open up and to heal the psyche.

 

[Finarfin]

So the next step is becoming who you are? I agree there is no mountaintop as such. Life is a series of becoming. And as it is a series of becoming (being) there will always be a next step. Think of the next step as moving forward. There will always be change and transformation if we want it or not. I think it is possible to use the power of transformation. Use it for healing. Use it for the individuation process. Use it to transform the self. Use it to be creative. Use it to help others and make the world a more interesting beautiful and happier place.
I think by using our free will we can give direction and purpose to our transformation if we want.

 

[Finarfin]

If we can learn something from our psychonautic exploration, what is it that we can learn?
How can we use what we have learned during our psychonautic exploration?
If you don,t use what you have learned from the psychonautic exploration, what is the point of learning it at all?
If psychonautism is nothing more then passively sailing the seas of the mind, what is the point of sailing?
I think that instead of passive recreational drug taking psychonautism can be dynamic and transformational.
Transformational in a positive way.

 

[Lotre]

It all depends. If you take purpose of life as being truly happy, then psychonautics, also as other things, can help you on this way, by knowing better who you truly are, what are your true desires, what really matters to you.

 

[herbmaster2015]

one can only imagine what we will be seeking out through meditation, closely monitored experiments, timed acid drops, or whatever else us we decide to indulge in .....the mind is endless, you can escape with music, a book, a hot chick, food..........the choice is endless, we are the designer welcoming mat in real life time, we are reality! we are the groundbreaking new thing, with a twist! pad in hand I trip into space, we are psychonauts in the world!

 

[darkwolfunseen]

For me, honestly, psychonautics is an extension of a greater journey. I have goals, dreams, ambitions, and they're all heightened and recalibrated through exploring the mind. If something can't survive that next trip, that idea was probably flawed to begin with.

In short, while psychonautics can be about drifting endlessly through the cosmos of the mind, it can also be about honing in on reassessing the things that matter most to you.

 

[Finarfin]

So what is it that matters most to you? And how does psychonautics help you achive this. What does it all mean to you personally.

Thanks for all your reactions it,s interesting to read all your posts.

 

[badilo]

well how i have changed is a hard thing to pin down but i will give it a go. i have definitely become more philosophical in my thoughts but there has been changes in my personality as well, like i dont have panic attacks or get paranoid anymore and have learned to be more happy with what i have and generally more happy about where i am but these benefits normally subside after a month or two. i dont think psychedelic experiences can be measured by linear steps