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Study into near-death experiences

  • Auteur de la discussion Auteur de la discussion GOD
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GOD

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A large study is to examine near-death experiences in cardiac arrest patients.

Doctors at 25 UK and US hospitals will study 1,500 survivors to see if people with no heartbeat or brain activity can have "out of body" experiences.

Some people report seeing a tunnel or bright light, others recall looking down from the ceiling at medical staff.

The study, due to take three years and co-ordinated by Southampton University, will include placing on shelves images that could only be seen from above.

To test this, the researchers have set up special shelving in resuscitation areas. The shelves hold pictures - but they're visible only from the ceiling.

Dr Sam Parnia, who is heading the study, said: "If you can demonstrate that consciousness continues after the brain switches off, it allows for the possibility that the consciousness is a separate entity.

"It is unlikely that we will find many cases where this happens, but we have to be open-minded.

"And if no one sees the pictures, it shows these experiences are illusions or false memories.

"This is a mystery that we can now subject to scientific study."

Dr Parnia works as an intensive care doctor, and felt from his daily duties that science had not properly explored the issue of near-death experiences.

Process of death

He said: "Contrary to popular perception, death is not a specific moment.

"It is a process that begins when the heart stops beating, the lungs stop working and the brain ceases functioning - a medical condition termed cardiac arrest.

"During a cardiac arrest, all three criteria of death are present. There then follows a period of time, which may last from a few seconds to an hour or more, in which emergency medical efforts may succeed in restarting the heart and reversing the dying process.

"What people experience during this period of cardiac arrest provides a unique window of understanding into what we are all likely to experience during the dying process."

Dr Parnia and medical colleagues will analyse the brain activity of 1,500 cardiac arrest survivors, and see whether they can recall the images in the pictures.

Hospitals involved include Addenbrookes in Cambridge, University Hospital in Birmingham and the Morriston in Swansea, as well as nine hospitals in the US


Towards the light


Last week witnessed the launch of two scientific studies that have the potential to answer the questions that have baffled humankind since the beginning of time.

Those questions are: what is the origin of life as we know it today, and what happens to us when life comes to an end?

Both the Hadron collider launched by the European Organization for Nuclear Research, and the more modest AWARE project launched by the University of Southampton, are scientific endeavours that may alter the way we understand and think of ourselves.

The former aims to study what happened during the first few moments after existence began - but the latter explores what happens after existence and human life as we know it ceases to be.

Although traditionally perceived as a subject for philosophical or theological debate, recent advances in medicine have enabled a scientific approach to answering this age-old question.

Death 'is a process'

Studies have found that 10-20% of people have near death experiences
Contrary to popular perception, biologically speaking, there is no 'moment' that defines 'death'.

In fact, death is a process that begins when the heart stops beating, the lungs stop, and as a consequence within a few seconds the brain ceases functioning and enters into a 'flatline' state.

From this point on, oxygen deprivation leads brain cells into a 'panic' state before they incur substantial damage and ultimately die over a period of minutes to hours.

So the question is: at what point during this process does the human mind and consciousness cease its activity?

We know nothing about the mind itself - it really is a mystery.

Is it at the moment the heart stops beating, or is it a few seconds, minutes - or even hours after the process of death has initially begun?

And what is the relationship between the mind and the brain during the state of clinical death?

These fascinating issues serve as the backdrop for the launch of the AWARE study, the world's largest ever scientific study of what happens when we die.

This study uses a combination of sophisticated brain-monitoring techniques to study the brain, while also employing an innovative method to study the mind and consciousness during clinical death.

Touching the void

Although many independent studies have shown that the brain reaches a 'flatline' state during clinical death, it has consistently been shown that 10-20% of people who are revived back to life report some activity of the mind.

These take the form of lucid, well-structured thought processes with reasoning and memory formation as well as the ability to 'see' and 'hear' actual events.

These observations have raised the intriguing - and controversial - possibility that the mind and consciousness may continue functioning after we have reached the point of death and the brain has shut down.

While an absolute impossibility to many scientists, for those who have experienced them and their respective doctors they are real. The key for science is to determine whether these experiences are illusions or whether they are real.

During AWARE, investigators will place images strategically in hospital bays, such that they will only be visible by looking down from the ceiling and nowhere else.

If after 36 months, hundreds of patients report being "out of body" yet no one can report seeing the images, then we must consider these reports to be nothing more than illusions.

If on the other hand there are hundreds of positive reports, then we will have to redefine our understanding of the mind and brain during clinical death.

For now though, only time will tell what the AWARE study will possibly reveal about our beginnings and our inevitable end.


Here is a video :-

http://news.bbc.co.uk/today/hi/today/ne ... 622456.stm
 
So you are looking at your own dying body and you care to look at some random picture on the top of a shelf nearby? :roll:

Yeah, real science.
 
We shall see what happens . The reality one goes throug in out of body and near death experiences is different than normal reality . You sound like you think that people would be to buisy shitting themselves to look around them . Its not like that , they have a feeling of detachment and curiosity . They dontt think so much , they are more aware than thinking .

The people doing the study are scientists and what they are doing has a sound scientific base .
 
I don't think they are shitting themselves. I think they have the opportunity to watch something that they identified with for so many years die away and don't interest themselves for other things like pictures of the doctor's grandson posing by the christmas tree. If they would be shitting themselves they would probably look for distraction in silly pictures.

It might be sound science, but I have my doubts. It is a highly personal experience and bringing in an external measure to see if it is truly an OOBE instead of an imagined one doesn't really matter, does it? Or maybe it does for people desperately trying to prove there is no spirit (or whatever other esoteric term you might have in mind) leaving the body and that there is no such thing as an afterlife (consciousness after death).

This is just playing with the definition of death. Seeing what is possible at some given state of being (no heartbeat, no brain activity). If consciousness is possible at that state they will just extend the definition of life and make burying people so much more difficult.

I think there are better ways to find all this out. For example: find out if the people having an NDE remember anything that happened to their bodies during the time they were out. Like seeing doctors fixing a tube into their abdomen or something they said that the person couldn't have heard as there was no brain activity. There are reports of this and I think it is intuitively more correct to approach the subject in this manner.
 
I agree that there are several diferent ways that it could be checked / proven and i think that the people doing the study are aware of that . One of the reason the study is being done is because of people reporting things that they thought had happened while they were gone / dead . Death is defined as no heart beat and no brain activity but people have been in that state for times from 1 minute and 1 hour and have then started to have a heart beat and brain activity and come back .

I dont think that people in that state would look for pictures or spend more than a short look at themselves . I think the prioritys become different . As for the bit about burying people , it wont make any difference as bodys are left for long enough to be pronounced dead , realy dead , before they get buryed . That problem would stay the same .
 
have either of you even experienced an out of body?

do you know for a fact what it feels like?

or what you would truly be thinking about?

i have, i gained full vision from every angle conceivable, able to see everything around me all at once, i was able to think, and at least feel as though i was speaking. and luckily enough i retained the ability to move myself back to my body and spark everything again. thus i am still alive today.

it is a beautiful thing, however. i can definatly understand many people being very frightened beyond comprehension, and their minds are attempting to make it easier for them, by allowing them the visual representation they wish.

the mind makes its own reality, in life and death. for death is not how we understand it. it is not a loss, or a journey, or anything of the sort. death is the passage at which we are confronted with 2 decisions. stay scared and closed minded and be reborn into the world again (you may or may not have any recollection of this event after the fact) or the ability to recognize your cosmic avatar in the vastness of the void filled with light of your inner star. gaining all the knowledge of the universe in the blink of a n eye.... and sadly when rejoining the physical form, losing all this knowledge just as fast.

that is the hell that is the physical existance bound by the fetters of fear and darkness.
 
Malaeus a dit:
have either of you even experienced an out of body?

do you know for a fact what it feels like?

I have not and therefore don't know what it feels like, but does that really matter? I have my doubts about the way this study was constructed, because I cannot imagine you being concerned whether some scientist you don't know wants to prove that your experience is or isn't real.
 
"have either of you even experienced an out of body? "

Yes .

And because of that i agree with fork about a person who is having an out of body experience not playing earthly games and looking for pictures on the top of cupboards . If thats all the test is about its dumb .
 
so desperate are people to find out about death..... :?
 
I`m looking forward to dieing .
 
oh nono, i was agreeing. anyone who has experienced this will not concern themselves with anything in this realm. and for the most part, i would go so far as to say 90% of all those involved would be blinded by their own mind. the "light at the end of the tunnel" etc. only a handful would be able to maintain themselves out of body, and of those. they would not touch anything in this world, it is of no concern to them.
 
I think the last mystery of life should not be solved when we are alive.

My opinion.
 
why not?
 
Thats what lifes about . Thats the highest spiritual goal . When youve done it it changes your life . Your life starts to mean something to you and you stop running away from it . ( and dont talk shit about georgia ..... )
 
exactly. I think that it not only changes your life but also the value of life. I don't know. I can't argue rationally about that. (oh-oh I now give fertile Ground for GOD to answer sarcastically)
 
im not sure if the mystery of death is something one CAN solve while still "living" in this plane. the concepts thereof would be extremely hard for any physical human to comprehend, one would have to be taught from birth a completely different set of values and facts, no curent physics or anything of the sort. allow their imagination to overflow with no limits, no knowledge of the existence of things "you cant do"
 
" the concepts thereof would be extremely hard for any physical human to comprehend,"

Thats what a full out of body experience , full ego death , white light experience can do/does .
 
perhaps the mistery of death is that it is not a mystery at all.
what are the cientists trying to explain ? why don't they study orgasms ?
it's their way of proving that the science has no boundaries and can explain everything. and that would be a really great advertising, wouldn't it ?
 
Out of body experiences are weird. I haven't had one since
I hit puberty many yrs ago. I remember having moments that I was watching myself from above and behind kinda like the video game GTA. I never shit myself or thought anything strange of them until I got older. I also had many dreams of events that happened the next day. I sometimes would realize that I had dreamed what was happening at the moment and would try to change it only to realize that that's what happened in the dream.
 
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