Concrete evidence

[mOnt]

Hey everybody! Okay I'm gonna sound like a dork, but I just started work on an argument essay in my english course. The thing i'm defending is, you guessed it, LSD. I've done my research for years now on the matter, so this would be no problem. Right?

Well, it turns out, I don't really have evidence for some of these things. Like, legit articles with scientists or anything that can prove:
LSD causes no physical, psychological or neurological problems.

LSD is not addicting.

"Bad trips" can be avoided/controlled.

"Flashbacks" are not real and/or not a big deal whatsoever.

LSD can be beneficial therapeutically/"cure" addictions/fix cluster headaches.

So I'm looking for evidence but I can't seem to find sources, and the key word here is legit. Now, I'm not some slacker who's trying to get people to do all my dirty work for me. I'm just trying to put this essay on steroids and totally impress my highly conservative teacher. So even if you have a source for only one thing on that list, it helps a lot! I just figured, some of you probably have a lot of these bookmarked or something after all the research and discussions held here, and you wouldn't mind lending a helping hand! :bear: Jam on fellow psychonauts!

 

[IJesusChrist]

You can read Stansislov Grof's Work...

Also, I wouldn't jump to conclusions. LSD isn't immune to the laws of chemistry or physics, all things in moderation:

Groups of rats were administered either 80 ?g LSD-25 continuously over seven days using subcutaneous minipumps, or were given the same total amount of drug in seven daily injections, or were administered vehicle. When tested long after cessation of drug administration, persisting alterations in behavior and brain were found in the continuous LSD groups. In social open-field tests, this consisted of decreased social distance between animals; this effect increased upon repeated testing. In uptake of labelled ligands, this was reflected predominantly by decreased 3H-LSD binding in several limbic regions. LSD appears to have especially persisting neurotoxic effects when administered in a continuous, low-level fashion.

http://www.simson.net/ref/1970/LSD_Flashbacks.pdf

Just go to google, go to "More" tab up past pictures, and scroll down to scholar. Thats where the good stuff is.

 

[Enivid]

An interesting newly released documentary you should watch from National Geographic Explorer: Inside LSD.

I am sorry, I have no legit sources for you.

 

[Guest]

LSD causes no physical, psychological or neurological problems.

Wrong, it can causes serious psychological damage.

Also, as IJC said, the dose makes the poison. Water may be non-toxic, but if you drink too much of it (and I'm not talking about drowning), you'll still die.

LSD is not addicting.

That's true, unless you consider that everything can be addictive, depending on the person.

"Bad trips" can be avoided/controlled.

Again, it depends. You can improve your chances by being careful with how much you take, with whom you take it and even more important caring about the setting, but shit may still happens if you're unlucky.

"Flashbacks" are not real and/or not a big deal whatsoever.

Flashbacks are post-traumatic stress syndroms, aka a purely psychological reaction (it's not LSD that "unhooks" itself from your brain). It's true that it's most of the time not a big deal (most people actually enjoy the sensation), but if it happens while driving or operating heavy machinery, it can become really dangerous.

LSD can be beneficial therapeutically/"cure" addictions/fix cluster headaches.

That's very theoretical, some studies are quite encouraging when it comes to medical use of LSD, but this field of research has suffered a lot from all the prohibition and so there's still a *lot* to be done.


I would make sure that you point out the things I just mentionned in your presentation, if you wanna convince someone who may already have his strong opinion on the matter, you gotta be extra careful not to present yourself as a "LSD RULEZ !!!!1" kind of guy, otherwise you may have the best info in the world, you will lack credibility to let it have any effect on the listener.

 

[Mescaline]

Aah I've done a similar presentation a few years back! Although I had a very laid back teacher ^^
Let me help you out, I'm sure I'm able to find some of the sources I used, or others

LSD and physical, psychological, and neurological reaction, tolerance (can be used to argue against addiction)
Voir la pièce jointe 4326

LSD and Cluster Headaches
Voir la pièce jointe 4324
Voir la pièce jointe 4325

 

[Mescaline]

(couldn't upload more than 3 articles at once.. :/)

LSD and Alcoholism
Treatment ofAlcoholism Using Psychedelic Drugs: A Review of the Program of Research (1998)
(can't upload this one it's too big... If you pm me your email, I'll mail it to you if you want)

LSD and long lasting (beneficial) effects
Voir la pièce jointe 4327
[attachment=1:3ngo7u1m]Psychedelics & Enhancing Creativity.pdf[/attachment:3ngo7u1m]

And finally I also have a digital copy of the book LSD Psychotherapy by Stanislav Grof, but it's too big to upload as well

Look at how recent alot of the articles are.. brilliant!

EDIT: I found another one you might find interesting ^^ it's about hallucinogens in general but has a particualer section on only LSD.

Voir la pièce jointe 4329


Hehe.. you have alot of reading to do ^^ :lol:

 

[mOnt]

Thank you very much to all of you, this is EXTREMELY helpful for me to help fight for the cause!!! ;p

Mescaline: I seem to be lacking in forum skills or something, I haven't been on one in ages. I just can't seem to find the PM feature, but I am very interested in those articles! The ones you posted already are exactly what I have been desperately looking for. :bear:

 

[Mescaline]

Hey there mOnt, glad to help out!
you can find the pm feature by either clicking the [PM] button below a user's name/avatar, to the right of someone's post (also see picture), or you can click on 'User Control Panel' at the top of the page, and then go to the 'Private Messages' tab.

I thought of something else you should probably mention in your presentation. You should make it absolutely clear that you differentiate between medicinal and recreational (and maybe spiritual) use, aswell as that these substances can only be used responsibly in a good set and setting with a psychiatric professional present , desireably with extensive knowledge of psychedelic substances and their use. Also I second everything Tiax said, except for that psychedelics can cause psychological damage. This has not been shown scientifically, it has only been shown that already latently present mental diseases might be brought to the surface by use of psychedelics, meaning it only catalyzed the onset of the mental condition, it did NOT cause it, the condition would have emerged at a later point in life anyway! How this catalyzation is brought about nobody knows (yet). I added an article on the subject.

Voir la pièce jointe 4331
It's actually more complicated than I explained here; the article also somewhat theorizes on the etiology of psychosis after psychedelics substance use.
However, this should make it clear you're not just some hippie acid head making bold claims about how amazing LSD is, how it showed you the inner workings of the universe and all that haha (even if it did ).

 

[_Avatar_]

Scientific standards have been raised since the '50s and '60s. Lots of psychedelic research was conducted without subjecting it to the "double-blind, randomized, placebo-controlled" standard of current academic research. That is why the research that was done then needs to be repeated now to generate concrete evidence.

Still, there's a lot of material that discusses the issues you raised. Some of the documents have been posted above by Mescaline. You can find more articles on psychology and psychedelics here:

http://www.psychonautdocs.com/

Here's a Albert Hofmann's archive:

http://www.erowid.org/references/hofmann_collection.php

A longer document that I think you should read:

http://www.erowid.org/psychoactives/guides/handbook_lsd25.shtml

And this book: LSD Psychotherapy

To learn about current psychedelic research, read the MAPS Bulletin.

Good luck with your endeavors.

 

[Mescaline]

woow that's one treasure chest of psychedelic info @ http://www.psychonautdocs.com/
thanks for that didn't know that site.

Besides the book LSD Psychotherapy by Stan Grof, you should seriously check out the day long seminar at the world psychedelic forum by Stanislav Grof, it's VERY interesting, I had a lot of fun listening to the seminar; it deals with the transpersonal perspective of human psychology opposed to the cognitive, psychosocial, evolutionary perspective etc etc. He discusses how to view a psychosis or 'spiritual emergencies' as Stan calls them, through the transpersonal perspective, differently from mainstream psychiatry/psychology, and the potential role psychdelics (LSD) play therein. And you can actually use some of it as a legit source!

The seminar was uploaded at the 'Psychonautica Podcast' (there are a lot of other interesting episodes to be found there as well!)
Psychonautica Podcast

The individual episodes casting the seminar are (if you want to save them for later listening: right click link -> 'save as'):
Psychonautica 74
Psychonautica 75
Psychonautica 76
Psychonautica 77
Psychonautica 78
Psychonautica 79
Psychonautica 80
Psychonautica 81
Psychonautica 82

 

[mOnt]

Thank you all, my paper was received very well by my peers and I couldn't of done it without the help of ALL of you.
I've gotten a lot of complements today, and listeners who were very skeptical about my topic had their entire perspectives changed, and even asked to keep copies of my paper.

I just have one more interesting question that no sources seem to cover... My professor cornered me with her beliefs that LSD gets stored in fat cells and in sperm/ovaries, which threw her off from my paper. The fat cells one was very simple to find out, because it's an alkaloid which makes it insoluble. But the sperm/eggs one... I have no idea where she heard that, and if it has even been successfully proven. I don't really need a legit source for this, but some confirmation from other psychonauts.

I'm so sorry for bringing up a dead thread!!! DD:

 

[IJesusChrist]

You can tell your teacher a molecule of every food she has ever eaten is still stored in her body. A molecule of water from the placenta in which s/he was born is still inhabiting her... somewhere in her body. A molecule from Jesus's, plato's, einstein's, and shakespeare's breathe reside within every inhale you take in...

However, LSD gets metabolized with a half life of 2-5 hours, it's derivatives after metabolization are oxidized products and are not psycho-active any longer. LSD doesn't get stored anywhere, and even so ... whats the matter? Thousands upon thousands of hippies in the 60's have had kids after taking LSD. EVEN SO, the amount would be in nano-grams. AND EVEN UPON THAT, lsd is a very reactive compound, well, somewhat less reactive in tartrate salt, however still active - and would get oxidized or even completely mangled in the human body due to pH's and the like.

Your teacher has nothing to worry about.

 

[_Avatar_]

But the sperm/eggs one... I have no idea where she heard that

I think she's referring to a very old myth, namely that LSD causes chromosomal damage. Stan Grof dedicates the second Appendix of LSD Psychotherapy to this issue.

Oh wait, the Appendix is available at the Psychedelic Library:

The Effects of LSD on Chromosomes, Genetic Mutation, Fetal Development and Malignancy