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50 page mescaline & peyote paper > 20 trip reports

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tregar

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One of the best papers on mescaline & peyote from the Heffter institute,

Over 20 total trip reports from the early history of mescaline, Euro & Western Science meets peyote/mescaline for the 1st time, most all of the trip reports mention hours of closed eye visuals, quite interesting....worn statues, gothic pillars, jewels, diamonds, every color imaginable and then some with closed eyes or with eyes open in a completely dark room with candle aglow. Enjoy if you haven't allready seen the paper, #2 down in the list, paper on LSD and it's lysergamide cousins is also very interesting. Note that Dr. Heffter has closed eye visuals at relatively low doses of mescaline hcl (150 to 175mg) towards the end of paper.

http://www.heffter.org/review/review2toc.html
 
Some of the best written descriptions of LSD compared with mescaline; similarities & differences:

From Christian Ratsch (Encyclopedia of Psychoactive Plants):
I have carried out experiments with varying dosages of Trichocereus pachanoi powder. With 1 g, I did not experience any effects. Two to 4 g produced a mild stimulation that persisted for approximately six to eight hours. This amount functions as a true tonic and restorative. I have also experimented with this dosage in the high mountains, where I noticed a distinct improvement in performance. If a person eats something during the time in which the effects are felt, the effects will increase as digestion begins.

With amounts of 5 to 6 g, empathogenic sensations appear alongside of the tonic qualities. Ten grams of the powder are unequivocally psychedelic, although few hallucinations occur. The psychedelic effects manifest more in the emotional domain. Very profound psychedelic effects an be achieved by taking some 50 ug of LSD with 10 g of San Pedro powder (cf. Ergot alkaloids).
FS:
mesc and acid are the cadillac of psychedelic experiences...

very nice, strong and can be quite powerful.
Murple:
The effects of LSD and mescaline are often described as being nearly the same in many older books and articles. While there are many points of similarity, these are two very different drugs from two very different chemical families. It is very hard to try to explain the differences to somebody who has not tried both, and this difficulty is made even worse because no two people will be affected by both drugs in the same way.

Many people feel that mescaline leaves you with a more lucid and coherent state of mind, where LSD can often create a very confused and disoriented state of mind. This does not at all mean that LSD is a more intense experience though. Some people find that mescaline produces stronger and much more organized visual effects, especially with the eyes closed. While LSD visions are often mosaics of rapidly morphing bizzarre scenes, mescaline visions tend to be more organized, less changing, and more familiar - the difference might be compared to watching a surreal music video compared to watching a movie. LSD tends to be much more of a stimulant, whereas on mescaline many people are more likely to lie down with your eyes closed. Some find mescaline produces a strong euphoria which is compared to that from MDMA. Some find LSD is more likely to cause anxious feelings.

Some people say LSD is much "deeper" while others will say that mescaline is the more profound drug - and others will say they're both equally deep. All of this is highly subjective, and varies greatly from person to person. LSD and mescaline are very different drugs, but with many things in common. Each has its own unique profile of effects, but what these are will be different for every person.
From page 26 of "Trout's Notes on San Pedro & related Trichocereus species" by Keeper of the Trout & friends:
The experience is a beautiful and fairly controllable one and lacking the overwhelming distortions and ego-death potentially encountered with a strong dose of LSD. I personally do not know anyone who has had a bad time with true Mescaline unless it was mixed with large amounts of alcohol.
Diaz, Jaime. How Drugs Influence Behavior. Englewood Cliffs: Prentice Hall, 1996:
Hallucinations produced by mescaline are somewhat different from those of LSD. Hallucinations are consistent with actual experience, but are typically intensifications of the stimulus properties of objects and sounds. Prominence of color is distinctive, appearing brilliant and intense. Unlike LSD, mescaline does not induce distortions of form or kaleidoscopic experiences. However, like LSD, synesthesia can occur.
fastandbulbous:
Er I think it needs to be pointed out that pure mescaline (it was mescaline hydrochloride that I tried) is actually noticably different to the mixture of alkaloids isolated from cacti in that the cactus extract has what I can only describe as more depth & richness to it - even then, peyote if different to san pedro (even san pedro has slighty different feel to peruvian torch extract) in that peyote produces a noticable flushing of the skin & more nausea in the initial stages - probably due to the isoquinoline alkaloids which are absent in the Trichocereus species. Overall I think I'd say that I prefer Trichocereus alkaloid extract over peyote, pure mescaline coming last in the list. I don't know where I'd place LSD in the above rating of the different mescaline containing extracts (& pure compound) as it is fairly substantially different withinn the whole range of psychedelic experience; LSD has more of an effect on cognative processing, but can be relentless in the way it forces the psychedelic state in your face. This is in comparison to all of the above mescaline variations which are much more gentle & less intense, but have an aesthetic enhancement quality that is almost non-existant in LSD by comparison.

I've had a ++++ experience from both, although with LSD it also involved a dose of ketamine to push it to that special state, whereas it was purely due to san pedro extract for the mescaline. Difficult to say which one I prefer as a comparison would be like comparing a savory food with a sweet one eg do I like enchiladas or blueberry cheesecake best (I really like both but just too different for a valid comparison as each is best for a certain mindset)!
Xorkoth:
The differences between LSD and mescaline would really only be indistinguishable by users who had only used one psychedelic, very few times, or who had not ever used any psychedelics. I think I know the study to which you are referring, and that study used people who had had very little to no previous psychedelic experience. Once you get some experience in several compounds, you realize how vastly different LSD and mescaline are, and indeed, how different almost every psychedelic chemical is compared to almost every other. There are literally hundreds of them, and each is unique in its own way. But mescaline is extremely, fundamentally different from LSD in every possible way I can think of.

For one, mescaline does not tend towards ego loss. Rather, it tends toward ego amplification and clarification. This is probably the biggest difference but it makes the two very different chemicals. Also, mescaline is very, very calm compared to LSD. LSD is a tryptamine, and like most tryptamines, makes the thoughts race, and contains a significant "mind fuck" aspect that can result in a very difficult but also very mind-blowing journey. Mescaline is a phenethylamine, and although not all phenethylamines are like mescaline at all, mescaline itself is characterized by a very calm and meditating mind state, with actually not a whole lot of racing thought going on at all. The mescaline state of mind is vastly easier to navigate with calm and uniform emotion, whereas the LSD mindstate (and mushroom) consists of rapidly fluctuating emotions. If one were to graph the effects, it would be a series of sharp ups and downs, whereas the mescaline graph would be more of a smooth, gradual sine wave, never getting as high as LSD might, but also never getting as low.

Also, the physical effects are drastically different, although at low doses to inexperienced users, I guess I could see how they would be indistinguishable. LSD consists of an "electric" body buzz, whereas mescaline is much more earthy and warm and pleasurable (in general), as is typical of phenethylamines in comparison to tryptamines.

Finally, the visual effects of the two chemicals are very, very different. LSD seems to dramatically alter visual perception so as to view objects in seemingly more dimensions than our usual three. Colors abound, and rapid breathing and morphing of objects is common. Also, fractals are common to see at higher doses. The visuals from LSD are sharp and crisp, and well-defined, and detailed to an astonishing extent. On the other hand, mescaline's visuals are generally much more subtle. There is a slowly breathing of objects, and a faint crawling of small things like print, but the biggest difference is that mescaline visuals are almost cartoon-like, in that they make everything stand out in enhanced color and vividness, but they don't even come close to the sharp, detailed visual enhancement of LSD and some others. Mescaline's greatest visual characteristic is often described as showing you the world around through a lens of enhanced singificance, if that makes sense.

Anyway, I hope this was illuminating to you on the differences between LSD and mescaline. I think that study is extremely misleading in many ways, because as an experienced user, I find the effects of LSD, mushrooms, and mescaline to be vastly different, and I guarantee I could differentiate between them at a sufficient dose for a full trip with absolutely no problems. it also helps that I've used somewhere in the neighborhood of 15 research chemical psychedelics as well, which haver really helped me to understand the psychedelic state and the differences between various drugs extremely well.

Also please keep in mind that my statements are generalizations, and every user will experience these drugs somewhat differently. But this should give a good general idea.
 
DM Turner on Mescaline:
THE HIGH:
The mescaline experience is my favorite of the traditional psychedelics (LSD, psilocybin, mescaline). I find it has the advantages of acid: a lucid, penetrating, focused ability of the mind, rather than the more dreamy, drifting state I get from mushrooms. However, I feel totally relaxed with mescaline, even calmer than I feel on mushrooms, and there's no trace of the metallic edge usually felt on acid.

Eating whole cactus produces a more body-oriented high than pure mescaline. San Pedro usually produces a very smooth, flowing experience. However, the effects of Peyote are quite different due to its unique mixture of alkaloids. With Peyote, the first couple hours of the experience are very dream-like, drifting, almost a delirium type state. During this time I feel groggy and sleepy and can do little more than lay back and sink into the feeling, which is not unpleasant. Some element of Peyote also acts as an emetic, making most people nauseous about two hours into the trip.

I find the mescaline experience to be more visual than mushrooms or acid. However, I've only experienced really spectacular visuals when using synthetic mescaline. My high tolerance to most psychedelics, along with the capacity of my stomach, has prevented me from ever being as high as I would have liked when eating whole cactus. Like psilocybin, mescaline tends to link me with collective evolutionary consciousness more than synthetics like LSD. The experiences produced by these natural psychedelics seem more "significant" than an acid high, which is more analytical. An acid high often seems to be a by-product of magnifying the mind, whereas with mushrooms and cactus one feels they are in touch with something ancient, spiritual, and personal. Mescaline has a unique signature in this context which I find most magical, a feeling that the Gods or protective allies are smiling down on me. The duration can be 6 to 14 hours depending on the amount consumed. The "coming back" portion of a mescaline trip is smoother than with the other traditional psychedelics. And I've never felt the "drained of energy" or "neural overload" feeling that can come after an intense acid trip. This allows for a more conscious and therapeutic return to regular consciousness, after which I can easily sink into sleep and wake up feeling refreshed.

Some aspects of the mescaline high are quite distinct from LSD or mushrooms. The visions produced by mescaline have a different character and structure. When being overtaken by a full strength mescaline trip, I've felt more than with any traditional psychedelic that I was an extraterrestrial being, immersing myself in new sensory phenomena for the first time. Where LSD or psilocybin heighten and clarify the sense of hearing, mescaline produces auditory hallucinations, heightening the hearing sense but also causing sounds to be quite different than normal. Mescaline also sharpens the olfactory sense to a much finer degree than LSD or psilocybin. I've particularly noted this in my ability to perceive the smells of numerous different plants when using synthetic mescaline outdoors. As for aphrodisiacal use of mescaline, wow!, it brought energies out of me that I never knew I had.
DM Turner on LSD:
THE HIGH:
Ecstatic feelings of love and happiness, affinity for other people, feeling of being at home with one's self and the universe, flowing visions with more intricacy, beauty, and color than anything found in nature, sound which one can taste and feel with heart and soul, a sense of suspension in time and feeling akin with eternity and infinity, a brilliantly lucid mind able to see itself from vast and novel perspectives, an overwhelming tide of emotions... These are the feelings that are common with LSD and most other psychedelics. One should also be prepared for the negative side: confusion, frightful visions and images, fear of dying or losing control, feeling controlled by and unable to escape from the definitions one has grown accustomed to, or being overwhelmed by the immensity of life.

The possible experiences on psychedelics are endless, and no two are ever the same. In the definitions I give for "THE HIGH" of each substance, I will try to describe the attributes that are frequently felt and distinguish the experiences produced by the different psychedelics.

LSD is the most transparent of the psychedelics. It has the least "signature" to it. Most users report that their first few trips are like a ride through the funhouse. Everything seems bizarre and completely unlike normal reality. After becoming familiar with the experience some people drop acid to perform complex computer programming, perform live music on stage, or do other tasks that require control and a strong connection with the physical plane. Frequent users may be able to blink their eyes, snap out of the high, and see things as they do in regular consciousness while on the peak of a 500 mcg. trip.

LSD's transparency makes it possible to have almost any type of experience. Users may guide themselves toward a particular flavor of experience using either internal focus, like meditation, or external stimulus like music or art. LSD's intensity is also quite variable. A 200 mcg. trip may feel more intense than a 500 mcg. trip from the same batch, and intensity can fade in and out during a session. Generally one will feel "higher" if taking the same amount of LSD, or any other psychedelic, in an unfamiliar environment. One aspect of dosage that seems consistent is the length of the trip. 100 mcg. Iasts me 5 to 6 hours, 200 mcg. - 8 to 10 hours, large doses have lasted up to 20 hours.

LSD has the ability of allowing one's mind to penetrate things very deeply. I find this most prevalent listening to music, looking at artwork, or making love. With LSD one can "lock on" to something like a piece of music and allow it to guide them on a sensual journey through a garden of liquid sound. One can lavish a feeling, thought pattern, or emotion with similar intensity. It's also possible to latch on to negative feelings. If one finds themself on a downward spiral they can usually redirect their awareness to something else with little effort. Most people tend to spend the majority of their experience in a positive groove, because once in it they can remain there effortlessly for hours. The negative aspects of LSD's signature that many users report are a " metallic edge " (a slight grating on the nerves), and sometimes an overbearing intensity that some psychedelics, such as mushrooms, tend not to produce.
Dale Pendell (about LSD...)
None of the others are LSD. Not mescaline. Not psilocybin. Many share some of its properties, none share all of them. Pharmacologically is is the same. While the phenethylamines, if plotted on a graph of activity versus 5HT2 binding, fall more or less on a line, LSD is almost off the chart, indicating a synergism of multiple receptor sites that is still not understood. (As much as receptor site binding can explain very much of what actually happens, which is not at all clear.)
DB:
I swear, the difference between different trips on LSD and the differeence between different trips on Mescaline are larger than the difference between trips on LSD vs Mescaline. for me. One sure difference for me is that I can take bigger doses of LSD and get more insight but I dont feel less able to take care of myself - whereas I start to feel less in control as mescaline doses get high.
PS:
They are really quite similar in many aspects, although I prefer mescaline myself. LSD is certainly more lucid, at times more intellectual, and a tad edgier than mescaline. Regular doses of mescaline (400-700mg) are indeed very calm and peaceful. Higher doses tend to be more difficult physically, and mentally vary depending on the "stability" of the person. Still, such things happen on higher doses of LSD too, although LSD, unlike mescaline tends to be purely confusing at high doses.

Mescaline has more of a zen, earthen feeling for me... I am very much satisfied just sitting and watching the wind move the leaves on trees or waves peacefully breaking. LSD however, I am much more in the mood for intellectual conversations and general "mayhem" (in good fun of course).

Mixing the two provides a most pleasant state, the best of both worlds - intellectual, peaceful, beautiful and quite fun. It's a combo I would certainly recommend to someone who is still exploring psychedelia.

However, I am a bit past that point, and enjoy psychedelics purely in a recreational fashion nowadays, so pure mescaline or mescaline and 2C-B are much more well suited - purely sensual, tranquil, and beautiful experiences (opposed to the thought-filled treks you get with LSD or combinations thereof).
psy:
For me shrooms have sort of a "negative", down baseline. It might be bodyload or secondary substances in the shrooms that alter the trip, but I always find it harder to stay social and keep the experience enjoyable.

Acid is pure neutrality for me. If I take some with a slightly sad mindset, the trip will be introverted, introspective, brooding, etc. If I take some in a good mood the good mood will stick around and I will be more sociable etc.

I find that mescaline (extract) brings a sort of slightly euphoric (mood-elevating) baseline along with it.

Also, the visuals between acid and mescaline differ, but I cannot really put my finger on it, because I am not very visual on any hallucinogen (while I have not tried DMT which is said to be the Cadillac of visuals).
kub:
like night and day.

lsd is more me, as in the trip is definitely an exploration of inner space while mesc seems like way more earth based and spiritual. also the quality of my mesc doses are always similar.... like the general feelings of extreme well being always persist.

mesc can sedate me at times even though it is a stim lsd always has me in high spirits.

not so with acid, it is very dynamic and always changing, each trip can have radically different feelings involved.

there are similarities for sure but the more you dose each substance the more you will notice they are not that similar. they are more different than similar IMO.
From "Timothy Leary, a Biography" by Robert Greenfield (page 177):
Two months later, Andrew Weil the best-selling author and alternative medicine guru who was then a Harvard undergraduate and an editor of the Crimson, obtained some mescaline from an American pharmaceutical firm. With seven other under-graduates, he began taking the drug fairly regularly in half-gram doses. During 1961, he had twelve highly varied trips. "Most were nothing more than intensifications of preexisting moods with prominent periods of euphoria." he later wrote. Describing his trips to Robert Forte in Timothy Leary: Outside Looking In, a Festschrift published after Tim's death, Weil said, "They started me on a road of experimentation in a lot of areas in my life; that I think got me to where I am today."
Ann Shulgin "Higher Wisdom" page 71:
But you don't want to go to the other extreme, saying that it doesn't matter what drug you take. The fact is that if you take DMT, you will not open the door that mescaline will open. They open different doors, and offer different experiences. But the experience is still part of your own interior condition, it is not contained in the drug. Because what you get is what your psyche or your inner teacher thinks it's time for you to get. Sasha: The doors are in your mind.
Shulgin's first psychedelic experience with 400mg of mescaline sulphate from "Psychoactive Sacramentals" 2001 edited by Thomas B. Roberts:
Let me quote from the book that Ann and I wrote, on this very matter. This was my very first psychedelic experience, the swallowing of a capsule containing four hundred milligrams of mescaline sulfate. This is what con-vinced me that tools do exist.

"The details of that day were hopelessly complex and will remain buried in my notes, but the distillation, the essence of the experience, was this. I saw the world that presented itself in several guises. It had a marvel of color that was, for me, without precedent, for I had never particularly noticed the world of color. The rainbow had always provided me with all the hues I could respond to. Here, suddenly I had hun­dreds of nuances of color which were new to me, and which I have never, even today, forgotten. The world was also mar­velous in its detail. I could see the intimate structure of a bee putting something into a sack on its hind leg to take to its hive and yet I was completely at peace with the bee's close­ness to my face. The world was a wonder of interpretive insight. I saw people as caricatures which revealed both their pains and their hopes, and they seemed not to mind my seeing them that way. More than anything else the world amazed me, in that I saw it as I had when I was a child. I had forgotten the beauty and the magic and the knowingness of it and me. I was in familiar territory, a space wherein I had once roamed as an immortal explorer, and I was recalling everything that had been authentically known to me then, and which I had abandoned, then forgotten, with my com' ing of age. Like the touchstone that recalls a dream to sudden presence, this experience reaffirmed a miracle of excitement that I had known in my childhood but had been pressured to forget. The most compelling insight of that day was that this awesome recall had been brought about by a fraction of a gram of a white solid, but that in no way whatsoever could it be argued that these memories had been contained within the white solid. Everything I had recognized came from the depths of my memory and my psyche. I understood that our entire universe is contained in the mind and the spirit. We may choose not to find access to it, we may even deny its existence, but it is indeed there inside us, and there are chemicals that can catalyze its availability."

chemistry of god

But what does all of this, you might ask, have to do with churches and religion? Everything. You may have noticed that 1 have avoided using either of the two words, church or religion. I have the same vague discomfort about churches, and their function, that many people have about drugs. Many view the church as an entertaining experience with music and ritual but provid­ing no profound value. To others, participation in church functions is used as a social vehicle allowing interpersonal activities to be enhanced and opened up. And yet to some, the relationship with a church offers precious insights and can provide the key to magical discoveries and personal spirituality.

It is just this quest, the search for understanding oneself, that defines, in my eyes, a religion. It is an inward quest, one that asks questions and seeks answers. I hope I do not offend too many, when I say that I believe that faith has nothing to do with true religion. The expression of faith is a statement of acceptance, acceptance of a system that is not of your own making. It is the placing of yourself in the hands of someone else, who might be anyone from a minister or rabbi to a Jesus or a Buddha.

As I continue my own personal search for my God, I am becoming increasingly convinced that He lies within me somewhere. Perhaps each person's own God lies within him; this is the meaning of the word entheogen. And if that internal God is the same God for all people, then we are all, in a sense, the same person. Perhaps the role of a sacrament in any religious prac­tice has been, and is, to let a moment's light be shed on that part of reality. There is a remarkable congruity between changes of states of consciousness, religious experiences, mystical experiences, and personal miracles.

what is in the future?

Again, speaking as a chemist and explorer, I remember my earliest intro­duction to the thrill of the test-tube. I had a Gilbert Chemistry Set in the basement of my home in Berkeley. It had remarkable things in it, like log­wood and bicarbonate of soda. I could make things fizzle, and there was even an occasional controlled explosion. I would go down to the University Apparatus Company on McGee street, and they would happily give me new things that had remarkable names, usually for free, and I would avidly read up on their properties from books that I accumulated as fast as I could. That basement was a smelly and magical place for me.

How many people who have enjoyed their lives as creative scientists have had their starts as mavericks in some rich learning environment such as this? I fear that this type of introduction cannot be repeated in our present genera­tion. Today, the presence of a "basement" smelling of strange chemicals would be seen as a drug laboratory, or as an environmental hazard, or as being in some other way socially unacceptable. Today, no one would sell, let alone give, a chemical to a child. Even adults can no longer buy chemicals from the major supply houses; most will only sell to businesses. In several states, one cannot even buy a beaker or glass tubing without a state permit in hand.

And there has been an avalanche of other legal impediments to these forms of free behavior. The laws have robbed us of all the sacred materials that might be used for sacramental purposes. And robbed us of the right to explore new and unknown materials that might have potential sacred properties. The enactment of the analog substances law has made it a crime to explore any substance that might be a catalyst in opening a door to one's own psyche. The chemical induction of a change of one's state of consciousness is now illegal.

I feel saddened that what little work is being done, in our culture at least, is underground. Much of it will never be made public and will remain unavai­lable. It therefore cannot become part of a research process that I feel is absolutely essential for the development of humanity.

But let me close on a somewhat more upbeat note. A synthesis of reli­gion and pharmacology lies just below the surface of this meeting. This union must be explored, with the acceptance of the personal right to believe as one chooses.
There must come a parallel acknowledgment of the individual's right to explore his own mind as he chooses. This meeting just may lay the ground­work for starting the search for a solution to this dilemma.
 
Turner's writings almost always turn out into a text where I can identify myself with. I always enjoy reading his material with excitement.

Pity that he drowned into his pool. :cry: For someone who suffered from a K addiction, he seemed to exist with no complexes.

As for mescaline and acid, I can only compare 30 cm/60 cm San Pedro with acid in the 100/500 mic range. Never tried peyote.

I'd have to say acid is more mathematical, symmetrical, pressured, and energetic, while San Pedro appears to be more colourful, calm, dreamy and loose. Pedro feels like a product straight from the raw nature, while acid is more a modern product and noticeable a chemical.

Imagination appears easier with mescaline, reading writings is enough to see the visual story. Meditation pulls me into a pool of fantasies of which I could only have dreamed. It is like standing still, and then being pulled deeper, as going through a circle of water to the next scene.

While on acid, I'll have to determine a bit more before I can jump on a lineair racing train. It goes faster but it has less suprises for me, short phases of boredom may appear earlier because of that. Especially after 6 hours.

As for the days after, acid leaves me a bit tired and minorly screwed, though very enlighted. With San Pedro, leaves me with energy and a fresh mind, equal enlightment.

I prefer mescaline but only with a few procents more, but it is so hard to get myself prepared. Every unclean food needs to be out of my system. Not to mention the hours and of cramps and stomach pain which I have to go through to get a reasonable dose ingested. Throwing up is simply a signal of a wrong preperation. And then there's appetite too. I'll have to eat cactus in bulk.

San Pedro can get me dancing like I have used amphetamines, while if I lay down, I'm accompanied by a total body relaxtion. Not being aware of gravity in both cases, a body like that Michellin man from commercials. :D
 
Thanks Brugmansia, I've read several of your posts, and really enjoyed your intelligent descriptions. I miss DM Turner as well, he was the man of psychedelia, his descriptions are right on key.

Swim's recent trip report:

220mg very light tan mescaline hcl along with 1/2 hit of hoffmann blew swim away in dreams the other night. Mescaline and acid is the bomb.

Swim is speechless, Swim picked up a seashell and saw it as if the 1st time swim had ever seen one, like swim was a kid again, music was in 3-dimensions, Swim laughed at the drop of a hat, frying in the mirror, way out there man, loved every minute of it. With closed eyes, saw elaborate ancient stone monuments and caverns elaborately carved and decorated, was taken on a short walk thru one of the caverns. The afterglow is nice. A combo highly recommended, mescaline imparts a significance and aesthetic appeal, with ultra-enhanced colors/beauty that really boggles the mind. The two combined is like a completely different animal; the "alien" otherworldness of cosmic intellectual electric acid with the "down to earth" beauty-enhancing euphoric mescaline, what a ride.
 
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